1995-09-20 - Plan Commission - Minutes REGULAR MEETING
BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION
September 20, 1995
Buffalo Grove Town Center,Proposed Kids's Choice
Child Care Center with an outdoor playground
`./ Amendment of the Planned Unit Development
Ordinance—Workshop#2
Chairman Goldspiel called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. in the Village Council Chambers,
Buffalo Grove Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove, Illinois.
Commissioners present: Chairman Goldspiel
Mr. Krug
Ms. Howard
Mr. Samuels
Mr. Lundine
Mr. Ottenheimer
Mr. Trilling
Commissioners absent: Mr. Rosenston
Mr. Berman
Also present: Mr. Marc Schwartz, Marc Schwartz&Associates
Mr. John Finnemore,Kinder Care Learning Centers
Ms. Meg Ambrogi,Kinder Care Learning Centers
Ms. Sheila Niehaus, Kinder Care Learning Centers
Ms. Judy Murtaugh, Simon Property Group
Mr. William Reid, Village Trustee
Mr. Robert Pfeil, Village Planner
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
Moved by Commissioner Ottenheimer, seconded by Commissioner Howard to approve the
minutes of the public hearings and regular meeting of September 6, 1995.
Chairman Goldspiel stated a correction to the last paragraph on page 7 of the Scarsdale public
hearing. He further noted a correction to paragraph 11 on page 5 of the Scarsdale public hearing.
Commissioner Samuels noted a correction of the date necessary to the footer on the regular
meeting. He further stated the motion noted on page 2 should show as passing by 6 to 2.
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 1
Commissioner Krug stated he would like the addition of the words"...and petitioner agreed to put
the fence in" added to paragraph 2 on page 5 of the regular meeting.
All Commissioners were in favor of the motion as amended and the motion passed unanimously.
COMMITTEE AND LIAISON REPORTS
Commissioner Samuels attended the Village Board meeting on September 18, 1995 and stated the
following items were discussed:
1. Approval of the annexation of the Wheeling Park District maintenance facility with
agreement by Wheeling to have the building fitted with sprinklers and payment out of
pocket for police and fire protection calls. In addition some accommodation will be made
during Buffalo Grove Days for possible increased use of the golf course. They also
agreed to some sort of discount for Buffalo Grove residents for the use of the Wheeling
water park during Buffalo Grove Days
2. Referral of request by Okamoto for outdoor storage in the business park
BUFFALO GROVE TOWN CENTER, PROPOSED KIDS'S CHOICE CHILD CARE
CENTER WITH AN OUTDOOR PLAYGROUND - AMENDMENT OF THE PLANNED
UNIT DEVELOPMENT (P.U.D.) ORDINANCE--WORKSHOP #2
Mr. Marc Schwartz of Marc Schwartz& Associates introduced the development members and
reviewed the issues discussed at the first workshop.
Ms. Judy Murtaugh of Simon Property Group stated they have designed a revised site plan in
response to the Commission's preferences. This plan shows the relocation of the dumpster pad
which has been enlarged to 16 x 20 feet. A service area has been created which is all concrete so
that it is easily maintained. Inside the dumpster area will be a floor drain and hose bib to facilitate
easy cleanup. The enclosure will also have an 8'gate.
Ms. Murtaugh stated the the dumpster area contains a shopping center dumpster, an 8 x 7 foot
dumpster for Max's, a recycle container and a 4 x 6 grease container. By making the dumpster
enclosure bigger, they have accommodated all of the requirements. The existing transformer will
be located in the service area and will be protected from the dumpster enclosure by 6" concrete
bollards. She further stated they will put a tentlike roof on the enclosure and have it match the
building itself Some area for venting needs to be maintained, probably along the sides of the
structure.
Ms. Murtaugh stated they have allowed for a 3'landscape area between the playground fence and
the sidewalk extension. This will allow for some sort of hedge row to be provided. They will
also relocate some of the trees from the north side of the property to the landscape island that has
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 2
been added.
Commissioner Krug asked how the grease would be removed.
Ms. Murtaugh stated the trucks come and attach a hose to the grease container and suck the
grease out. In addition there is a steam cleaner on the truck which cleans out the grease
container.
Chairman Goldspiel noted one container will need to be moved to get to another.
Ms. Murtaugh stated the enclosure has been designed in such a way that the most access uses are
closest to the gate for more frequent pickups by the waste disposal company.
Commissioner Krug asked if the gate will be closed and locked manually.
Ms. Murtaugh stated yes.
Chairman Goldspiel asked for comments on the change in ages of the children to be
accommodated at the proposed facility.
Ms. Sheila Niehaus of Kinder Care Learning Centers stated one of the reason for the changes in
the age groups is that this is a very new concept in their business. In such a new venture, changes
are often made in response to the needs and desires of the community. She stated they have
found a need to add kindergarten and a limited number of pre-schoolers. She noted this would
not be infant/toddler age groups but rather ages 3 through 5. This would be added to help
parents have more convenience by not having them drop off children at two or three separate
places. In addition, there would be hobby classes on Saturday. Busy working parents lack the
time to take their children to some enrichment type of classes and this service would be a
wonderful addition for these parents.
Chairman Goldspiel noted that a statement was made at the last meeting to the effect that the
lease of the premises limited use of the facility to children 6 years and older.
Ms. Murtaugh stated the lease will be revised to fit the needs of the tenant.
Chairman Goldspiel asked if there would be any changes to the outdoor facility necessitated by
the change in age groups.
Ms. Niehaus stated there will be no changes in the outdoor plan. She stated the planned
playground will meet the requirements of DCFS qualifications for all the age groups they propose
to serve.
Ms. Niehaus stated children are very carefully supervised when on the playground. The same
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 3
DCFS ratios that are required within the building are also required outside. The teachers are
required to have organized activities prepared for the outside and there is ample equipment to
maintain the childrens' interests.
Chairman Goldspiel asked how many children are allowed on the playground at one time.
Ms. Niehaus stated DCFS ratios require one adult with every twenty children.
Commissioner Trilling asked if there would be restrictive times for children ages 3, 4 and 5 to be
at the center.
Ms. Niehaus stated the times are not restricted, however, the numbers would be restricted. She
stated at present they are restricting that age group to 20 children.
Commissioner Trilling asked if there would be any green space in the play area.
Ms. Niehaus indicated that green areas are not planned for the play area.
Commissioner Trilling noted concern with mixing 3, 4 and 5 year olds with older children.
Ms. Niehaus stated it is not their intent to mix the younger children with the older children. It is
their intention to provide a segregated space for the younger children where they would be cared
for with their teachers. She noted their playground time would be separate from the older
children as well. In fact, the older children are also segregated in terms of the grade they are in
school and in terms of their age group.
Commissioner Trilling asked if a separate room would then be provided for the younger children.
Ms. Niehaus stated that was correct. She further stated the equipment would be different and
there would be lower adult/child ratios of 1:10.
Commissioner Trilling noted with the lack of grassed areas for the kids. He stated during the
summer this seems particularly important.
Ms. Niehaus stated she has operated several centers that do not have grassy areas and they have
had a high level of satisfaction from parents in those facilities and found the children have
enjoyable outside time. Part of the program also involves field trips, particularly in the summer.
Children would be going to parks and other attractions in the community.
Commissioner Trilling noted that parks such as Willow Stream are close to the center. However,
it would be necessary to cross Buffalo Grove Road which would be a dangerous undertaking.
Ms. Niehaus stated most field trips are taken by way of vans.
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 4
Commissioner Trilling asked if the proposed facility will offer meal plans.
Ms. Niehaus stated there will be a full service kitchen with food service personnel to prepare
breakfast for all and a morning snack, lunch and afternoon snack for pre-school kids.
Commissioner Trilling asked if kindergarten would be taught at the facility or if kids would be
taken to the public school for classes.
`./ Ms. Niehaus stated both services would be available. There is a certified teacher available to
teach the kindergarten class.
Commissioner Ottenheimer asked how many Kids Choice facilities exist today.
Ms. Niehaus stated there are about 44 center nationwide.
Commissioner Ottenheimer asked how many of those are in the same type of physical layout as is
being proposed for Town Center.
Mr. Finnemore of Kinder Care Learning Centers stated about 40 to 42 are located in similar
situations.
Commissioner Ottenheimer asked if there are more management or supervisory problems in this
type of situation as opposed to free standing facilities.
Ms. Niehaus stated no. She noted they have security systems on the doors and a very orderly
system for bringing the children to the facility and loading buses.
Mr. Finnemore stated that of all the facilities built in strip malls by him, this facility is far superior
for the playground area in protection than any of the others. The large courtyard area in front is a
1 superb amenity for this facility for bringing children to the facility.
Commissioner Ottenheimer asked for the approximate distance between the trash enclosure and
the playground.
Ms. Murtaugh stated there is a 4'landscape island, a 5' sidewalk and the curb winds around.
Commissioner Ottenheimer stated he is concerned with the proximity of the trash and dumpsters
to the playground, especially in summer with increased bees and insects.
Mr. Finnemore stated they have been concerned with that concept and that is why they have been
very careful with how the trash enclosure is designed. The addition of the floor drain and hose
bib will give them the ability to keep the area cleaner and hopefully keep the insect problem down.
However, if it becomes a problem further efforts will need to be made.
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 5
Commissioner Howard asked if the dumpsters will be covered.
Ms. Murtaugh stated the dumpsters normally have lids.
Commissioner Samuels asked if there is a price difference between use of a free standing facility
such as the one on Busch Road and the proposed facility within a mall area.
Ms. Niehaus stated the price has not yet been determined. Typically the prices are very similar in
the marketplace now. Sometimes due to the extensive amount of specialized school age
equipment, the price may be up to five or ten percent higher.
Commissioner Krug asked if there will be screening around the vent area.
Mr. Finnemore stated they may be able to screen the bottom and top of the dumpster area to keep
airflow going.
Commissioner Trilling noted bees will get in despite any kind of screening.
Chairman Goldspiel stated this is a much improved design although the playground area is still
very grim looking. He asked if there is enough space for the kids.
Mr. Pfeil asked the developer to review DCFS playground requirements.
Ms. Niehaus stated they are required to have 75 square feet per child for 25 percent of the
enrolled children and this design exceeds those requirements.
Mr. Pfeil stated the health officer has indicated concern with the size of the dumpster area as it
exists now in relation to the number of tenants and volume that has to be served. The new
additional information will be presented to the health officer for further comment. The nuisance
factor of wasps and hornets are of concern to the health officer who also mentioned pest birds
tend to cluster at these types of facilities. The building and zoning department was concerned
with the emergency egress from the playground. They mentioned that two gates may be needed
on this playground. The fencing around the meter banks will need to be more definitive than what
is shown so far. A three foot clearance would apply and the site plan needs to be drawn more
correctly. The Fire Department has noted that the distance between the bollards would be better
at 4 inches on center than 6 inches on center. These details need to be worked on with the
petitioner.
Chairman Goldspiel noted the following items needed to be addressed at the public hearing:
1. Provide information regarding the 40 plus other Kinder Care Learning Centers as well as
their success with 3, 4, and 5 year olds
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 6
2. More information on the playground and efforts to mitigate the grimness
Commissioner Krug asked if there will be any exterior lighting on the playground.
Mr. Finnemore stated they are not planning any lights on the playground.
Chairman Goldspiel noted it may be a good idea to provide some lighting as kids will be dropped
off as early as 6:00 a.m. in dark winter months.
Ms. Murtaugh noted the entire shopping center is on a photometric system and it may be possible
to incorporate lights to run on that system.
CHAIRMAN'S REPORT -None
FUTURE AGENDA SCHEDULE
Mr. Pfeil stated there will be meetings on October 11, 1995 and October 18, 1995.
PUBLIC COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS -None
STAFF REPORT -None
NEW BUSINESS -None
ADJOURNMENT
Moved by Commissioner Krug, seconded by Commissioner Trilling and carried unanimously to
adjourn. Chairman Goldspiel adjourned the meeting at 8:45 p.m.
Res ectfully submitted,
ay Ru n, ecording Secretary
PROVED BY:
S PHEN SP , Chairman
Buffalo Grove Plan Comm-Regular Meeting-September 20, 1995-Page 7