1978-04-19 - Plan Commission - Minutes REGULAR MEETING
BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION
April 19, 1978
Chairman Carl Genrich called the meeting to order at 7:35 P.M. in the
Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard.
Commissioners Present: Chairman Genrich
Mr. Shields
Mr. Goldspiel
Mr. Kandel
Mrs. Sheldon
Mr. Button
Commissioners Absent: Mr. Harris
Mr. Capitel
Mrs . Force
Also Present: Mr. Harry Sleek, Levitt
Mr. Bruce Johnston, Johnston & Associates
Mr. Greg Boysen, Village Engineer
Mr. Bart Delaney, Planning Coordinator
Mr. Jim Truesdell , Staff Planner
Mr. Tom Fennell , Director of Community Development & Planning
Approval of Minutes:
Commissioner Goldspiel moved to approve the Minutes of the April 5, 1978
Meeting, subject to correction. Commissioner Sheldon seconded the motion,
and upon voice vote, the motion carried. Commissioner Kandel abstained.
The following corrections were made: On page 4, Item #4, it should state
"Concerned about how this will interface with Long Grove." On Page 4, Item
#1 , "The ownership." should be expanded to show "where each unit will be sold
individually, or where one-half the units will be rental , and showing the lot
lines on the Plan."
Chairman Genrich stated that Mr. Bill Balling asked that the Plan Commission
review the plans of Arlington Heights Road. Also, the Commission should consider
re-appointments. A statement will go to the Board this Monday.
Wagner Farm/Levitt
Mr. Truesdell stated that the new plan shows the new curve in the road with
a 250' radius, discussed at the last meeting. The fiscal impact comparisons
have been revised. The Duplex units will be $55,000 to $60,000 per unit.
Revenues meet 99% of expenditures.
It was a concern that snow removal on the cul-de-sacs would be a problem.
The Public Works Department and the Fire Department do not like the islands
in the cul-de-sacs.
Buffalo Grove Plan Commission
April 19, 1978
Page Two
Mr. Delaney commented on the curve of the road. Commissioner Harris explained
the curve of the road at the School Board Meeting. He said, according to Mr.
Hitzeman, the School District's architect can work with this curve. A small
triangle shape South of Brandywyn is being considered for parking. There was
then discussion on the curve of the road.
Chairman Genrich suggested that the next step would be a Public Hearing.
He wants solid input from the staff, and stated that the staff was going
to give additional information on neighborhood planning.
Mr. Truesdell showed planned use roads and reviewed the surrounding zoning.
There is a piece of land 600' wide running between the Wagner Farm parcel and
proposed Buffalo Grove Road, which has no street connection to the South.
The Land Use Plan shows single family dwellings. The actual use for this pro-
perty is limited because of the large flood plain; possible use would be some
type of multiple family dwellings .
The internal road system does not seem to be a major problem. The staff feels
that the plan as proposed is a good one. A 900 turn on Brandywyn would be
an impractical idea; and, the staff would like to see Brandywyn come through
with a 250° radius.
Mr. Delaney talked with Mr. Balling and Mr. Bill Davis, and stated that it
is doubtful , at this time, whether a portion of the site will be used for
a well site, but could be used for some type of storage in the future, such
as salt storage.
Mr. Tom Fennell stated that the approved Master Plan of the Village shows
substantial open space. He discussed the maintenance of the land: That is,
would it be maintained by the Village, the Park District, or the developer?
The staff is not in a position to recommend who should take care of such
land; Mr. Fennell feels that it should be policy. The Wagner land is
50-60% open space, and he does not feel that policy should come from the
staff. His opinion is that he envisions it as some sort of a nature area.
A presentation can be made to the Park District Board on April 27th.
Commissioner Goldspiel suggested that we should make the policy, rather than
make the staff do it. He has difficulty visualizing what it should be until
he knows what the characteristics are:
1 . Haughton Muck - will it be possible to walk over the ground, or will
it be such that you would sink into it?
a. If this is farm land now, maybe we are not in a situation where we
have prairie - what pressures would come when people move in as to
a collection basin for debris, etc.?
Buffalo Grove Plan Commission
April 19, 1978
Page Three
2. What would the vegetation be like?
3. What is the creek/stream drainage to be like? Will it look like a
natural stream?
Mr. Sleek showed on the sketch that the developer is trying to improve the
slope of the land to help the water drain into the natural water bed.
Commissioner Goldspiel questioned the slope of the land; Mr. Sleek stated
it would be 1%. There will be 1 '-11' of water in this stream 90% of the time.
During a heavy rain, this would flow to the East at the rate of 1' per second,
which should be fast enough to prevent mosquito breeding, etc.
Commissioner Goldspiel suggested that there be a dry weather channel 5'-10'
wide which would be natural , so that this stream would not become full of
stagnant water.
It was said that there are three possibilities:
1 . That the land stay a farm.
2. That some extensive work be done on it.
3. Leave it the way it is, and have something in mind that will prevent it
from becoming an eyesore, etc.
One problem is that the Park District hasn 't had any money to develop all
land that should be developed.
Commissioner Kandel feels that the Park District should be involved in this,
because it is open space, and the Park District should be involved in "open
space".
Mr. Delaney suggested that the Commission convey, either in writing or
representation, to the Park District that they should become involved in
this discussion.
Commissioner Sheldon raised the question of whether we want this land to
be passive recreation, or active recreation. Her feeling is that we should
make this piece of land a passive recreation area. She feels the school
area will provide a sufficient amount of active recreation area.
Commissioner Button raised two points:
1 . The Park District will have to maintain this area.
2. Where does the water go in semi-dry situations - he does not want to
see it become a mosquito problem.
Mr. Boysen said there might not be any velocity at all during some conditions .
Chairman Genrich said that the Village Attorney informed him that, in the change
of the PUD Plan, it is the Plan Commission 's decision as to whether we need a
Public Hearing.
Buffalo Grove Plan Commission
April 19, 1978
Page Four
Does the Plan Commission feel that we need a Public Hearing? Chairman
Genrich feels that we do.
Commissioner Shields talked about the islands in the center of the cul-de-sacs.
Is it possible to put something in the middle of the cul-de-sac that appears
to be an island, but really is not; such as paving the center with bricks, etc.?
The developers stated that the only alternative is asphalt, because of the cost
of brick, or any other similar material . He stated that the outside radius
of the cul-de-sac is sufficient, and that emergency vehicles would be able
to drive over it if necessary. The island would be grass, and have a raised
curb. He also said it would be a good place to store snow. The outside radius
of the island is about 20' .
Commissioner Goldspiel does not like the idea of having the two cul-de-sacs
so close together at one point. He wondered if it could be made into one
loop street. Mr. Bruce Johnston said that had been considered, but they did
not do it that way, because it would then have to be one-way, which was felt
would cause problems.
Commissioner Goldspiel questioned the report of the Lake County Department
of Planning and Zoning, which stated it was felt that Aptakisic Road has
the potential for being developed as a scenic highway. It was stated that
this just means that it should be made sure that it would be pleasant looking,
not necessarily turning into a "Lake-Cook" road type. This should be addressed
by the Appearance Control Commission.
Commissioner Goldspiel also wanted to make sure that the lots will be deeper
on Buffalo Grove Road.
Commissioner Goldspiel stated that provisions should be made for an on-site
retention/detention pond. It was stated that the whole area would be engineered.
He also thinks the lot lines must be shown between the units. Mr. Johnston
stated that the present plan just shows concepts, and he will put in the lot
lines on the future plans.
Commissioner Goldspiel talked about the economic impact of the units. He
understands the change as presented by the papers suggests that the new plan
is slightly bettor than the approved plan. Is $40,000 for a townhouse low?
Mr. Sleek said that these will be a combination of condominiums at $35,000
and townhouses at $40,000, and that they already have a development of this
range in Schaumburg. The duplexes will be 2-3 bedrooms, which will keep
the density of the area down. The church site will be left as R-9 zoning
for the present.
Commissioner Kandel questioned whether the Fire Department would reverse.
their position on the cul-de-sacs. It was said that they do not veto them,
they just do not like them. Commissioner Kandel does not like the islands
the way they are now because he feels that, in the future, they would look
bad because of deterioration. He asked if there are any lots requiring
variances, and the answer was "No".
Buffalo Grove Plan Commission
April 19, 1978
Page Five
Commissioner Sheldon agreed with Commissioner Kandel . She feels that the
islands will turn into trash collectors.
Chairman Genrich likes the looks of the islands, and is in favor of them,
with the possibility of getting rid of the ones at the end of the long
cul-de-sacs, where there would be more of a problem for fire equipment
getting in and out.
Commissioner Goldspiel agrees with Chairman Genrich, and is in favor of
the islands.
Commissioner Button is also in favor of the islands, and likes the grass in
the center. He said that one way to avoid breakage would be a low profile
on the curb.
The final vote was 4 in favor of the islands , and 2 against them.
Chairman Genrich:
1 . There will be a Public Hearing on this proposal on May 17. It will be
on the April 10 plan, but should be amended to show the 25-year flood plain.
2. The Plan Commission should have 1 or 2 representatives at the Park District
Meeting on April 27. The Plan Commission is in agreement that it should
be a "passive" park.
Chairman Genrich would like Commissioners Force and Kandel to attend the
Park District meeting, letting them know that the Plan Commission is very
interested in this open space area being developed into a "passive"
recreational area. The Plan Commission will do everything possible to work
with the Park District and other agencies.
Chairman Genrich wished to strongly point out that , just because there is
multiple housing in this particular area, we will not allow a majority of
multiple housing in the surrounding areas, and does not want anyone to think
that a lot of duplexes will be put in.
Commissioner Goldspiel wished to underscore that we will not allow high
density housing to be put in.
Chairman Genrich stated that he wants the plan to show the lot sizes,
division of the lots, the building outline on the lots, and the 20 or 25-year
flood plain.
Commissioner Goldspiel questioned the legality and problems arising from
common driveways. Mr. Sleek will check with the Village Attorney to see
whether there are any problems or not. The Plan Commission is unanimously
in favor of the common driveways because of the aesthetics, but just wants
to be sure there are not problems.
Buffalo Grove Plan Commission
April 19, 1978
Page Six
Reappointments:
Commissioner Shields moved that the Plan Commission recommend reappointments
for 3-year terms for Commissioners Goldspiel and Sheldon. Commissioner
Button seconded the motion. Commissioner Sheldon discussed her reasons
for wanting her reappointment to be postponed for another meeting. Another
new member will be appointed shortly, and it was felt that the new member
should be appointed for a 1-year term rather than a 3-year term.
Commissioner Shields changed his motion to read that we appoint Commissioner
Goldspiel to a 3-year term. Commissioner Kandel seconded the motion. The
motion was unanimously carried by voice vote.
Arlington Heights Road:
The Village Engineer presented construction proposals for the Lake and Cook
County portions of Arlington Heights Road.
Commissioner Kandel :
SUBJECT: Pre-Construction Conference Meeting for the Widening of Arlington
Heights Road between North of Dundee Road and Lake-Cook Road
The Village Engineer was informed that it would be necessary to close the
intersection of Arlington Heights Road and Dundee Road for a period of
between 2 and 6 weeks. This would require re-routing of local traffic
through other Village streets. This local traffic consists of passenger
vehicles, Nortran bus routes, and major construction vehicles, who will
be working in the close vicinity of that intersection. We don 't believe
our local streets were designed to handle heavy construction vehicles or
large buses, as is being recommended due to the closing. We would recommend
that every effort be made through the Secretary of Highways, State of Illinois,
to maintain traffic North/South on Arlington Heights Road at all times during
construction of this road widening.
Our main point is that we do not want the road closed.
Mr. Delaney said that the Public Hearing will be held Wednesday, April 26th,
to discuss the NIPC land use and housing policies. There will also be a
Public Hearing on May 10 to discuss the Lake County, Arlington Heights Road
widening.
A motion was made to adjourn by Commissioner Shields, and seconded by
Commissioner Button. The meeting was adjourned at 10:15 Q.M.
Respectfully submitted,
fyAlLk. LtYY. L;)-2w/AA,
Janet M. Sirabian
APPROVED: Recording Secretary
4EL/a Plan Commission
Regular Meeting
April 19, 1978
Carl Genrich, Chairman