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1985-11-13 - Plan Commission - Minutes WORKSHOP MEETING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION Fiore Property Seifert Property November 13, 1985 Chairman Sheldon called the meeting to order at 7:35 P.M. in the Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove, Illinois. Commissioners Present: Chairman Sheldon Mr. Goldspiel Mr. Krug Mr. Musfeldt Mr. Laskie Mr. Gal Ms. Kaszubowski Commissioners Absent: Mr. Davis Mr. Demski Also Present: Mr. E. Zale, Fiore Mr. B. Johnston, Architect, Fiore Mr. J. Martin, Land Planner & Architect, Fiore Mr. K. Carmignani, P.B. , Consulting Engineer Ms. K. Lang, Tax Impact Analyst,Fiore Mr. E. Bieszczad, Develper, Siefert Mr. J. Ezzi, Engineer, Seifert Mr. R. Coffin, Plan Commission, Long Grove Mr. L. Kendig, Land Consultant, Long Grove Ms. M. Kowalski, Village Trustee Mr. J. Truesdell, Village Planner COMMISSIONER LIAISON REPORT: Commissioner Krug attended the November 11, 1985 Village Board WorkshopMeeting. The Plan Commission action concerning the Rescorp project was recapped. After the unanimous decision to deny the proposed development, Rescorp may consider a reduction of 10% of the density. It is up to thePlan Commission to determine if a representation should be taken to the Village Board. Mr. Krug considered the proposed 10% reduction to be a lotof give on the part of the developer, and recommended Rescorp come back. Mr. Truesdell commented that according to Mr. Hal Franke, the decision will be left up to Rescorp. Ch. Sheldon will keep the Plan Commission posted on future developments. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 1 FIORE PROPERTY WORKSHOP Mr. Zale stated that further changes have been made. He introduced the architect, Mr. Bruce Johnston, Johnston Assoc., Inc. Mr. Johnston distributed Report P ZL52 and described the basic plan. He reviewed the new location of the Multi-family area, the Estate area (1/2 acre lots), the 10,000 sf. single family, and the golf course which has been moved farther North. The Commercial area will consist of l0acres, and the Light Industry will consist of 22.8 acres (North of Rt. 22). South of Rt. 22, is the Mixed Residential areas which consist of Townhouses and Carriage Houses.L:These units are designed for the maximum view to the rear,and-are-located on cul-de-sacs. Mr.. Johnston described the road system, particularly Buffalo Grove Road, which, when widened to 4 lanes, will become a collector road. A path for pedestrians, bikes or golf carts has been added to provideaccess to the golf course, and the recreation center. Mr. Martin described the density changes that were made after the Village Board Workshop. The overall number of units has been reduced from the original 1,245 to 1,112. He reviewed each type of building proposed.He outlined the use of the 439.7 acre site. The residential area totals 246.4 acres: 64% of the residential land will be used for single family homes and 36% for mixed residential. The overall density will be 2.07 units per acre. There-will be a total of 556 units in the mixed residential area: 204 - Townhouses and 252 Carriage Homes. The parking was reviewed. Each unit will have individual garage entry and apron space providing a ratio of 1 or 2 to 1 parking per unit. 167 guest parking spaces have been provided on the cul-de-sacs. The setbacks were also described. Mr. Carmignani gave an oral traffic report which was requested by the Village. Data was compiled from_ existing roadways:with_estimated trips based on land use figures. Traffic counts were taken at 11 intersections. Peak hours were 7 AM to 8 AM and 4:45 PM to 5:45 PM. The emphasis was on the traffic leaving and entering the proposed subdivision. The review was lengthy and a detailed written report will be submitted. The most troublesome intersection was Weiland and Aptakisic, peaking at about 1,480 vehicles per hour leaving the subdivision in the morning, heading East._ There was no corresponding PM problem. People are apparently finding an alternate way home. Other intersections_.operating.between_C and D levels are_Rt. 83/Half. Day Rd_.; Prairie/Aptakisic and Prairie/Half Day Rd. There are no inter-sections, adjacent to the site, that currently have operational problems. There is a problem of cut through traffic at Strathmore Grove, from Arlington Hts. Road to Thompson, to the Brandywyn and right out on Aptakasic Rd. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 2 f. n Tnis occurs because Arlington Hts. Road is closed at Long Grove. Statistics were given for other traffic patterns and intersections. It was noted that some of the study was made before -the new plans were delivered. Mr. Carmignani commented that the new plan generates a total of about 570 trips that will entering the development in the morning; and roughly 530 trips leaving the development in the morning.- It is important to note that of the 570 trips entering in morning, over 400 will be coming te'the- light industrial -area. The commercial and light industrial areas will=gererate 90% -of the-total"trips, or-a magnitude of- 2 or3 to 1 ratio. In- the 'evening, -the °trips leaving the- development and entering the roadway system are in-the magnitude of about-900 vehicles-during the PM"peak hours. About 800 vehicles will be coming into the site during the PM peak, so 50% or 400 of those trips are accounted for by the commercial and light industrial area; using the 2-lane Route 22. A worst-case position was taken, regarding the commercial property. The Arlington Heights Rd.- - Lake/Cook Rd. was used as an example. Considering all trips to be "new trips" `comingfrom outside the area, and using 1980 census-•data;- 45%`would-be coming-frost the West, headed East; and 15% would be' living East and headed West, on Half Day Road. About 35% would be using Buffalo-Grove Road-going-South '(depending on how -far -Buffalo Grove Road -is extended) and 6% would use --Prairie -to-Aptakisic Road traveling East. - Mr ' Carmignani's report concluded with the- intersections which will require'=improvementsincluding right turn- lanes. Half Day Road and Prairie Avec-will- require-widening=to 4 lanes each. c Until the commercial and light industry areas are completed, Buffalo Grove Rd. and Half Day Rd. will not require 4 lanes. He added that people will discover their own short cuts.Also, it might be wise to termiate Port Clinton Road because of poor''iightdistance and because-it is difficult to manuever to Rt. 83. It would bebetter for people to use main roadways. The-impact-of the commercial/light -industrial areas on the traffic was discussed by the Plan Commissioners. It was noted that the Village standard is for all intersections to have left turn lanes. Mr. Zale said he agreed with the traffic report. He introduced Ms. K. Lang, of Barton-Aschman Associates, Inc. Ms. Lang distributed copies of a Fiscal Impact Analysis and described the expected tax revenues through"1991; from School Districts 96, 102, 103 and High School District 125. The chart reflects a deficit from School District 96 because single family homes typically generate school age children. ' -The figures•do not' include contractor's contributions. The charts show conservative--estimates, based- on property tax figures. The actual income will probably be -greater. There will be no need for new schools. Com. Krug asked for a more detailed description of the mixed residential use-area. Mr. Martin responded, using artist's sketches of the models. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 3 The architecture was described. Unit sizes, garage entrances, and patios were described. The cul-de-sacs were designed so that units have a good view of the golf course.. Basements are optional. , Prices will range from $90,000 to $120,000,.for.Carrage Homes;. $120,000 to $155,000 for Townhomes. Many of the units are ranch units, with cathedral ceilings. The plan will actually have_a low residence impact... Mr. Zale added they are losing some density because of_the open spaces around the units. The development will be very attractive. The road system-will-have a lot of animation in terms of 5av1ng;the existing_trees. Some mature trees will be moved from the golf..course.- A model-area site has not been chosen. The golf course is the;only-recreational-area to-be-provided. Mk.Mr. Goldspiel suggested that it could be used for additional.activities, .such as cross-country skiing, or jogging. Two swimming pools are planned. Tether balland tot-lots may be included at the recreation areas. Com. Goldspiel was also concerned about the need for additional right of way space. Mr. Truesdell agreed that when Buffalo Grove Rd. widened, additional right-of-way space will be necessary. Mr. Zale said he was aware of this requirement. The physical screening of the industrial area and residential was discussed. Mr. Zale said uthis wuld:becarefully controlled: -Proper berming landscaping, and entry-would be important. They would not want to deter the sale and development_of.the_residential area, so the buffer would be very heavy. Com. Laskie asked about the development stages. Mr. Zale responded that the 3 single family areas would be started at the same_time:° -The Estate:.lots for the custom homes would be sold to another developer; If-the-projectqs approved-by-January 1986, the golf course architect would like to have trees moved by March. The sales center could be opened by late summer or early fall. He hopes to complete the subdivision-in-3-1/2 years: :- The custom homes will range from $225,000 UP with lots valued approximately $50,000_each. They:could stipulate in the Annexation Agreement that all-houses would have 2-car garages, basements, ands minimum of 2-1/2 baths. Mr. Truesdell stated that B.G. population calculated through the year 2000 to be approximately 42,000. The water allocation was projected through this time period, and was based on population and non-residential water usage. He would have to research beyond the year 2000. Com. 'Laskie commented that the plan is very attractive. He agrees that more recreation area is needed, especially at the South end of the project. He offered no suggestions, except that the golf course could be used_after hours foradditional- activites. Traffic:on Buffalo Grove Road is-a-real concern when it increases over the next .years. :_ FHe is against the 30 MPH speed limit on residential streets. Will Buffalo Grove Road be extended to the North? Mr.. Truesdell said there is_no specific schedule being considered at this time, however the right..of way to Busch. Road is available for 4 lanes. It is being discussed with Mr. Zale and could be done when the development is completed. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 4 Com. Laskie asked about'sidewalks `in the mixed-residential area. There will be no sidewalks around cul-de-sacs, but there will be sidewalks on all the fully dedicated right-of--ways. Cul-de-sacs are dedicated back of curb. The Estate areas will have ditches and no curbs. They will work with the Engineering Department. All Village standards will be met. Variances are being requested for the cul-de-sacsthat are longer then 500 feet. Mr. Martin explained the positioning of the cul-de-sacs. The length will- limit the number and eliminate the need for many smaller lots backingup to Buffalo Grove Road. The longest onewill be 700 feet. There is also a"golf`'course path which will-- serve 'as a fire lane. There are islands atthe end-of--each cul-de-sac which provide the additional parking. Com Laskie-asked about the set backs, noting that Long Grove donated 100'along Route-22. Mr. Zale said they will give 50 feet, and bdded that they are preserving all the existing trees for a more scenic view. There is also the viewof the golf course to be considered. Fences will not be allowed in the multi-family areas; but the single family area will not be restricted from fencing. Some limitations as to location and height •could`be required: ''Road widths were discussed. 100 to 120 feet are required. Transition between single family and the golf course was discussed. The-areas will be compatible and have character transition. Several types of trees are proposed: pines, firs, spruce and more pines. The Village will maintain snow removal on-the cul-de-sacs. No bike path is planned, but if Staff wants one along Buffalo Grove Road, Mr. Zale said Alley would provide an extra 5 -feet for this purpose. He added that they want to encourage people to walk. -Th'e-traffic patterns and- potential Problems were discussed again.' Should some of the streets be wider? Should more be-considered collector streets. Overnight parking could be 'provided for guests on the cul-de-sac islands because these are not dedicated.- They-are maintained by-the Homeowners' Association-.- Com. Gal 'Stated that the Master-'Plan-should be followed.It was noted that the wider Streets encourage speeding. The on-street parking is provided primarily for guest parking. Occasionally cars are parked on the street for convenience, and are rarely parked on the street in the peak traffic time periods. Mr. -Truesdell stated that the street widths are adequate. Also, relating to the rest of the property, this plan represents approximately 60% of the total area to be dedicated. The Master Plan shows a large amount of industrial property North of where Zales's industrial is proposed. It is important to have sufficient industrial frontage. Part of this area is now, in accordance with Mr. Zale's plan, now residential. The overall comprehensive plan is now being reviewed with two basic Village goals be established:- 1. Lower density- . .Traffic issues In the area North, the land use pattern is not industrial. The question is whether it is better to have light industrial or should residential be considered? There-will be less traffic if it is residential. To the North will still be single family and offices- ;from the standpoint of density and traffic. Buffalo Grove P-lan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 5 Com. Gal would prefer to have the industry on Rt. 22 because of the access to the tollway. This means less truck traffic near residential. The plan as presented includes more multi-family than now exists in the Village. Developers are now saying they must have a mix of single/multi or all multiple family, in order to make it work ecomomically. Another thing to consider is what will become of Port Clinton Road. Mr. Zale had no questions or - comments. Mr. Coffin commented that there will be a future problem when other projects-are developed. It is normal to request developers to up-grade the;_roads near their property. In Long Grove, there are 100 foot scenic easements being provided; there are also required conservation easements _and ,dedicated land. He continuedto describe the future plans of.;Long_ Grove, River Woods, _Kildeer, North Barrington, Deer Park, Inverness, etc. to build on basic 1-acre lots. He agreed that B. G. has-too much multiple-family. . Reject developers' plans that are not acceptable. -Single family residential will be perfectly tax supportive. Regarding the water projection, there is the question of future supply being adequate. Mr,` commented that while this plan is better that the previous proposal,_. it still_ dles;not,;meetJongGr_ove',s standards. He described the open space mandates. -It was hisGopinion that the subject area could be held to lower density because it-has the trees, and landscaping, and .thierefore ;the.rural;characteristerics can:-be preserved. He also indicated- that much of the-soil'ia -unbuildable, including the golf course. Mr.---Zale strongly disagreed and he challenged ru . Kendig to prove his Statements. , _It is`economically.,feasible_,to engineer the site. Ch. =tue1aon said that studies are available to Buffalo Grove and information can be provided regarding the areas to be preserved in their natural state. Mr. Truesdell described what the Park District will accept as active or passive park land. It will not accept property within the 100 year flood plain as active park land. He will make a report available to the Plan Commission that Barbara Dolan is preparing. -- - After a short intermission, it was decided to take the proposed project to a public hearing,, ,as soon as the paper work can be. done. Com. -Musfeldt made a motion to this effect. Com. Krug seconded. Mr. Truesdell will prepare the Traffic Report, Bike Path, Roads, Zoning for Light Industrial, Extension of Buffalo Grove Road, the Water, Inside sidewalks system, Soils (totally unbuildable by architectural and other standards?) and Ecologically important nesting grounds. Mr. Truesdell said the soonest he can be prepared would be December 4th. Voice Vote was AYE Unanimously. NO Opposed. NO abstensions. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13. 1985 - Page 6 Si�Fert Property -tom. Kasztibowski excused herself because her employment brings - her- 'in conflict-with the -developer. Mr.. Edward Bieszczadrepresented the developer, Anden Corporation. The site plan was presented and Mr. Bieszczad said the plan reflects all the changes Staff has requested. The buffering between the residential and commercial property has been agreed to by Anden. A profile drawing of the berm with proposed plantings was also presented. It shows the Flotation of-the single family residents in relation to the commercial property. The uu„mercial piece is- set. back._55._fee.t..from. _the property line. The buffer zone will be 25 feet, .:per:-the minimum specified in the ordinance. Plantings will consist of evergreen trees for all season screening. The .Village Forester's selections will be used. There will be a six foot solid fence at the rear property line of the single family residents. Mr. Truesdell clarified to the Commissioners that the plan is not being submitted for approval. The cross section is the commitment of the Anden ,Corp.-:_to_.the:type:of buffer _zone that will be required as the standard. Even if Anden does not develop_the::commercial property, the plan would be (part of the_continuing agreement. me Buffalo Grove Road.:entrance__to the commercial property is about 210 to 220. :feet from Checker Road.--,The entrance to the single family on Checker is about 275 feet from Buffalo Grove Road. .Ch..Sheldon asked it_they had considered moving the entrance road and locating it between the commercial piece and the single family lots? This would not be feasible because there would only be 1 row of houses and there would be a double frontage problem. At this time, there are really no plans for across Buffalo Grove Road. A plan was submitted, but never approved, for an office building. The Town Center concept developed and discussed, but not adopted, indicated commercial office frontage basically along Rt. 83 and multi-family residential on the Buffalo Grove side. Com. Musfeldt commented that the commercial, as proposed, will be located in the wrong place, looking forward 3 to 5 years. It could be totally cut off and surrounded by single family. It was his understanding that there would be commercial only along Route ,83._ , Mr.. Truesdell recalled that the Board asked that this site be changed to commercial. The Plan Commission has been receving requests for multi-family for the entire site. Various plans have been discusseu .;ith Anden. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 7 Can it be all-single family? Can the commercial be reduced in size? Could there be a multi-family buffer? Mr. Bieszczad said it would not be economically feasible for Anden to build the residential without the commercial. The commercial has_been reduced. .The_buffer is being proposed in response to.the. Plan_Commission's concerns. It complies with the requests made by Staff and the Village Board Multi-family will not be feasible. Com.,-Goldspiel 'brought up..anotner concern about the row of smaller single family-lots which will require°variances. Would taking out one lot and increasing the sizes of the other lots solve the problem? Not really,.-because if the_square-footage requirements are met, there will still be-a rear yard distance'problem." In the'R-- 4 district, 40 ft. rear yards are required. . In.contrast, R - 4 A rear yards are 30 foot. What-is being proposed are'35 foot rear yards, with a 5 ft. variation. Actually, two variations will be required, square footage size and rear yard set back requirements. After discussion and some measuring, Mr. Bieszczad said they can solve the square footage problem by reducing the size ofLot 19':and increasing-the size of Lots 17 and 18. The 7 foot side yard set back=-requirement canbe met. Another separate issue is the school district property. Mr. Bieszczad said they will secure attorneys to contact the schools and remove what ever can.be removed._ This_cannot-be done until -the-project-is approved. Mr. Truesdell said Andencannot petition until they own the property. He has spoken to both superintendents (Dist. #96 and Dist. #102) and it would seem:-reasonable-to-them-to work:out -the boundary lines. Ch:= Sheldon felt the school problem can be resolved and the irregular lots can be-resolved by variation. -The main problem is the commercial area. She proposed a Polling of the Commission to determine whether the retail is favorable in this location. 41r. Bieszczad asked for a 2 part Poll: a) in favor of the single family b) in favor of the retail in the proposed location a) Single Family: Yes Krug, Goldspiel, Gal, Laskie, Musfeldt -No - *Tone b) Retail, on this piece of property: Yes - Krug No 1-:Goldspiel, Gal, Laskie (has possibilities), Musfeldt (what-will be across B.G. Rd.?) Mr. Truesaell repeated his statement that nothing is planned for across the street. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 8 • Ch. Sheldon pointed out, for consideration, that in very close proximity there is a school, and the rectory. Commercial in that location will increase the traffic pattern, not the volume. The proposal might not be in the best interest of the children. Mr. Bieszczad responded that_the site will not support a. store, such as White Hen. It is. intended. for somethingjike-a bookstore, cleaners, or Crate & Barrel. It is not a typical strip center. Research has been done and convenience stores have no interest in a location such as this. Because there is no major-highway to give exposure, Mr. Gal said this reinforces the 'pinion that commercial should not be there. A business like Crate & Barrel could not exist. Ch. Sheldon suggested something-like a health club, or something with low volume traffic might be viable there. There seems to be an impass. The village Board has referred Anden to the Plan Commission because it was originally to be,multi-family,-and now will be single family with the retail. Anden has said this is the only way the project will be feasible economically. The Plan Commission is clearly not in favor of the retail. Can there;,be a plan without the retail? Mr. Bieszczad asked if they can go to the public hearing without the commercial? Would only the single family be acceptable? Ch. Sheldon said, "ro, because_they might be left with a piece of property that is potentially unbuildable." Mr. Bieszczad recalled=all the changesthat have already been made in an effort_to_satisfythe,Village-and„Plan Commission requests. He has reduced;te number ;of;:lots from 100 down to 89. The Plan Commission has divided the property into two specific situations across the board. The poll, indicated the Commission is in favor of the single family, but not in favor of the commercial. He has been trying to get approval of the property for over 1 year now; and would like to have the public hearing so it can go to the Village Board. Continuing, Staff has instructed certain off-site improvements be taxed on this piece of property. The amount of money it will take to construct, or contribute to the Village for improvements, must be charged to something. The Village is asking for so much, only commercial property can support it. If the commercial never gets approved, Anden will still own the improved property. It can take a loss, or possibly sell the property, or the Village may change its mind and. allow the commercial to be built. The Village Board has already seen this plan, and if it had been totally against the proposal, it would not have sent the concept to the Plan Commission. Ch. Sheldon countered that often when the Village Board sends something to the Plan Commission, the final project can be very different that the original concept. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 9 Mr. Bieszczad described the improvements the Village is requiring: a) a water main - starts at-Buffalo Grove Road and ends at Checker, 16 inch; this will complete the Buffalo Grove water system. If-the Plan vommission will consider a commercial section of 1/2 the size, Anden will put in the water main up to the property line. Mr. Truesdell added the reason for this requirement is because the Village is-,now taking over the park'property contribution and the water main is needed to complete the route system, in order to have pressure for the entire Village. It--is- not needed for'this development, but it is Village policy to say if a piece of property is adjacent to water main on a plan then the developer is asked to put in that water main. The`discusion continued, Fand`Mr -•Bieszczad said his part of' the water main would be $80,000. To build the part that goes beyond his property would require more approximately=$140,000. up to Checker Drive. The Park District will not contribute. When asked if Anden could build the single family only? Mr. uieszczad responded, "No, because water main is not the only issue. There 'is'a-sanitary sewer that was built by Trammell Crow, and there is a re-capture against this property also. The Park District is not willing to share in this either. Time is a growing factor. Since the project was started a year ago, cost has escalated in excess of $125,000. Every time Anden comes back, the clock is=running on-this re-capture element with Trammell Crow; and there are also additional clocks-running. The project has-been discussed, and re-discussed, and things have been agreed upon, but there has been no progress. Ch. Sheldon stated she felt the fairest thing for the Village and the developer, considering the economic costs, would be to get a legal opinion from Mr. Raysa as to some solution. The Plan Commission is not in agreement with putting the retail on the project; and the developer says he cannot build without the retail. There are some legalities, regarding the re-capture, that the Plan Commission has no knowledge of, so additional information is needed. Com.=Goldspiel suggested treating the $ amounts as a political issue. It would best to deal with the Planning-issue, "'have the public hearing, give the Plan Commission recommendations, and let the Village Board deal with all the other issues concerning the park district, the sewers, Trammell Crow re-capture, etc. Mr. Bieszczad stated he is basically- a residential builder, and the poll indicated the Plan Commission would allow him to build the houses, but not the shopping center. He asked for a public hearing. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 10 =Mr. Goldspiel-said the vote at the public hearing would be on the whole intergrated plan, single family and retail; not two pieces of property. With the property vacant, there is a possibility that it might go through. Because the public hearing requires time and money, the question was raised of whether the proposal, with the political issues, etc. , can go to the Village Board without a public hearing? Another thing to be considered is that -the Village Board can override the Plan Commission. Or, a new plan can be submitted. Regarding the possibility of the Village Board waiving of the improvements, Mr. Bieszczad said he has discussed 'this -possibility, and the way the ordinance reads is that the first builder -to develop must-put in the improvements. The ordinance provides tunequal division of the responsibility to put in the water main, etc. Com. Musfeldt stated this has been a problem with the Town Center for all _these years.= No one has wanted to be first and put up all this money. He has:.said that the Village should be the first to invest some money up front. _Oh. .Sheldon suggested that the next step would be to go for the public .hearing as soon as all the work can be done. The date should be worked .out- :withucJim -Truesdell.= ANNOUNCEMENTS FMr-.•-Truesdell _sale that -next-week, Nov. 20, 1985 will be a public hearing for.Creekside; and a -workshop for Grove Square Plaza (formerly High Point Plaza). There is a -new developer and he wants to move one building back .and:pr_ovide .parking_ in :the frost.; ADJOURNMENT Com. Goldspiel made a motion to adjourn. Com. Gal seconded. Ch. Sheldon adjourned the meeting at 11:30 P.M. Respectfully submitted, „8:--gLI-e, Gte-•:i. Shirley Bates, Substitute Secretary Buffalo Grove Plan Commission sb :Buffalo Grove Plan Commission November 13, 1985 - Page 11 Approved By: • Barbara Sheldon, Chairman