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1980-08-20 - Plan Commission - Minutes REGULAR MEETING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION The Orchards August 20, 1980 Chairman Shields called the Regular Meeting to order in the Municipal Building 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove at 7:35 P.M. Commissioners Present: Chairman Shields Mr. Goldspiel Mr. Button Mr. Davis Mr. Shifrin - arrived at 8:05 P.M. Mr. Glover Mrs. Reid Mrs. Kaszubovski Commissioners Absent: Mrs. Sheldon Also Present: Mr. Mansukhani, Developer, The Orchards Mr. Jessen, Architect, The Orchards Mrs. Park, Administrative Assistant COMMUNICATIONS None BDDC Commissioner Glover stated that the BDDC met on August 5, 1980 to review design schemes presented by Ken Tucker and A ssociates for a food and drug type develop- ment in the Town Center• The Commission objected to the strip type of development." "We are still open to any proposals as long as they propose some imagin- ative use. This use was to be primarily on the southern end of the property, specifi- cally the south east portion of the Town Center site. We did consider the develop ment on the Henderson property which is on the north east corner of Lake Cook Road and Route 83. We stated that we have no objection to a seven acre site that would develop a grocery/drug store type development. Any well designed planned unit develop- ment east of the Center would have the BDDC 's blessing as long as it would restrict the use of retail stores. Tire stores, nursery -end garden shops, home centers, anything that would not compete with the Town Center would be acceptable. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 2 - Commissioner Davis - Regarding the Town center, Arlington Heights is developing a shopping center at Arlington Heights and Lake Cook Roads pretty soon. As a result, we are going to be losing revenue to Arlington Heights. I think it is time that the Village Board, the Plan Commission and the BDDC take a new look, become more realistic and start bringing that revenue in to the Village of Buffalo Grove. Chairman Shields - There is a dialogue going. I think that we on the BDDC are open to any development that is properly designed. Commissioner Button - With the money situation today, I would hesitate to imagine that someone is going to build right now. Commissioner Glover - The consensus is that we are winning now. We do not have a franchise row. Food and drug stores do not really have the highest economic revenue available. Commissioner Davis - The people who live in Buffalo Grove are going to wind up shopping at an Arlington Heights center. The concept of a Town Center with a great mall is not going to happen. The money is not there. We cannot afford to let our neighboring villages develop ahead of us. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Commissioner Glover moved that the minutes of the May 21, 1980 Public Hearing be approved subject to correction. Commissioner Kaszubowski seconded the motion. Page 3, paragraph 3 change compensation to compensatory; page 8, paragraph 5 change Zoned land to Annexed land. AYES: Commissioners Button, Davis, Reid, Glover, Kaszubowski NAYES: None ABSTAIN: Commissioner Goldspiel ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon Commissioner Davis moved that the minutes of the May 21, 1980 Regular Meeting be approved. Commissioner Kaszubowski seconded the motion. AYES: Commissioners Button, Davis, Reid, Glover, Kaszubowski NAYES: None ABSTAIN: Commissioner Goldspiel ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 3 - Commissioner Kaszubowski moved that the minutes of the May 28, 1980 Public Hearing be approved. Commissioner Reid seconded the motion. AYES: Commissioners Button, Reid, Kaszubowski NAPES: None ABSTAIN: Commissioners Goldspiel, Davis, Glover ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon Commissioner Glover moved that the minutes of the July 2, 1980 Regular Meeting be deferred. Commissioner Davis seconded the motion. AYES: Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Davis, Reid, Glover, Kaszubowski NAYES: None ABSTAIN: None ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon THE ORCHARDS Mrs. Park briefly reviewed Mr. Truesdell's memo to the Commission dated August 15, 1980 titled 'the Orchards." In answer to a question from Commissioner Davis, Mr. Mansukhani stated that there is a 1.7 acre lot between Steepleview and The Orchards. II' Mrs. Park stated that the staff communicated with the owner of that property to ascertain whether he had been contacted by this developer. The owner stated he had talked to the developer and had no desire to sell his property. Commissioner Button - What is the front yard set back? Mr. Jessen - We have a right-of-way there that is a dedicated street. Commissioner Goldspiel - How many feet are we short on the front yard if you do not include the parking spaces. Mr. Jessen - You are 5.1 feet short. Mr. Mansukhani - There is 70 feet of back yard. Commissioner Goldspiel - The ordinance says that you cannot have parking in the required front yard. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 Mr. Mansukhani - The isle between the parking spaces is 26 feet and the ordinance states 20 feet is required Commissioner Goldspiel - Why not shrink the parking 5 feet so that we have more green in the front yard and less pavement? Mr. Jessen - The living portion faces the rear yard looking to the north and con- sists of the kitchen and master bedroom. This is the informal living area. Commissioner Glover - I would like to point out that the plan is not really drawn to scale. Mr. Mansukh9.ni - We have eliminated the garages and given you the open space you requested. Commissioner Button - What is the estimated selling price of these units? Mr. Mansukhani - It would be hard to determine the price for next year at this time. Commissioner Glover - From a land planning standpoint this is the best plan you have presented to us. Without the public street that we are now getting the piece to the south would have been land locked and development of that parcel would be very difficult. Commissioner Button - I think the only other issue is the set back of Building One. I feel there are no problems with that because of the nature of the property to the north and the trees on this parcel. Commissioner Glover - Maybe staff could measure the overall building height. Mrs. Park - This type of building would be measured from the g22ade level of the building to the top which is actually greater than 26 feet. I am not sure what way they measured it. Mr. Jessen - To the top of the ridge is 35 feet. Mrs. Park According to the ordinance the mansard roof is measured to the deck line of the mansard roof. Commissioner Goldspiel - What does that mean? Commissioner Glover - It means that it is a 35 foot set back. Mrs. Park - I believe that Jim talked to the building department and they said a 26 foot set back would be required. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 f - 5 - Commissioner Button - Can the visual height of the roof be changed by altering that roof structure? Mr. Jessen - It is a hip roof. That part of the building that reaches 35 feet height will be at least 35 feet away. Commissioner Glover - That is a good try but that is not the way it works. Commissioner Button - If you would alter it to a flat roof structure would there be any visual difference? Mr. Jessen - You would have a bad roof condition. Commissioner Goldspiel - We need a larger side yard than front yard. Why do we have a bigger set back from the property line than we do between dwellings? Mr. Jessen - The minimum side yard, according to the ordinance, is 12 feet. You can, according to the ordinance/park in the front yard. We are establish- ing now two dedicated streets instead of private roads. Beyond the right- of-way there is a 25 foot section. I read in your ordinance that you cannot put parking in the front yard set back. In a planned development, does that mean I have to have 25 feet of greenery before the parking? Our front yard is really from the building. Commissioner Davis - Jim is recommending basically, that we vary this plan,accord- ing to his memo of August 15, 1980 to the Commission. Commissioner Glover moved that the Conceptual Plan proceed to the Public Hearing phase subject to a side yard set back of one times the building height or 35 feet pending receipt by the staff of all the necessary documents including: 1) a landscape plan 2) list of density incentives 3) a schedule of the timing of the development 4) restrictive covenants to be utilized by the condominium association. Commissioner Davis seconded the motion. Discussion Commissioner Button - Regarding Building One I do not know if I am sure about going back another 5 feet to 10 feet. I think the line of trees on the property and the fact that the developer has brought his density down six units should be considered. I do not want to crowd the detention area. I do not want to change the building style. I think the 5 feet should come from the parking area. Commissioner Davis agreed with Commissioner Button's comments. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 6 - Commissioner Goldspiel - I agree with the 5 feet and as to the difference between 25 and 35 feet I have not been able to sort out that ordinance yet. Before I would accept anything less than 35 feet I would want to have that ordinance explained. I suspect that this building could be moved a little in such a way that you could get in the 35 feet without serious problems with the detention area. If it is in the ordinance that you have to stay within the 35 feet I would want to stay within it. Mr. Jessen - We tried to open up the view from the back of the building. I think we can get down to 9 feet for the side yard. Commissioner Glover - We would be asking 70 feet set back for the property to the north if it were single family. It is going to be multi-family so it is 35 feet. Otherwise, we will have to permit the property to the north to have 25 feet setback. Then we are going to have a row of buildings along Weiland Road that will be wall to wall. Commissioner Button - The point I am making is this is worthy of a variance. The Vote AYES: Commissioners Reid, Glover, Davis, Chairman Shields NAYES: Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Kaszubowski ABSTAIN: Commissioner Shifrin ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon Commissioner Goldspiel moved that the developer be instructed to meet the min- imum front yard requirement by adding 5 feet to the front yard green space. Commissioner Davis seconded the motion. Discussion Commissioner Glover - You are reducing the parking area so we have 21 feet between isles? Commissioner Goldspiel - Our ordinance requires 20 feet. Commissioner Glover - Regarding parking lot design, would 21 feet between aisles be sufficient in your opinion? Mr. Jessen - In the direction cars are going now I would say yes. Your Longest new car is 18 feet. I would agree that you are being progressive in reducing black top area. Commissioner Button - What if you put angle parking in? Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 7 - Mr. Jessen - We are over on parking by 10 spaces. You do not want to restrict yourself on parking. In answer to a question from Commissioner Glover, Mr. Jessen stated you have 16. 5 feet between the right-of-way and the curb. Snow will be likely put in the de- tention area. Commissioner Glover - I do not like to see the parking lot reduced below proper engineering standards. I think we should leave it as it is. Commissioner Goldspiel - Our residential streets are 27 feet. What we are talk- ing about here is a parking lot the width of a street. Commissioner Glover - You are backing out of a parking stall of 9 feet. You need this room to turn. The Vote AYES: Commissioners Goldspiel, Davis, Shifrin, Reid NAYES: Commissioners Button, Glover, Kaszubowski ABSTAIN: None ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon The Commission was polled as to whether they wanted 5 feet taken from the parking lot or 5 feet taken from the rear yard. Parking Lot Rear Yard Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Reid Commissioners Goldspiel, Davis, Shifrin Glover, Reid, Kaszubowski TRANSPORTATION COMMISSION Commissioner Goldspiel stated that regarding moving the Number 234 bus route up to Weiland Road, as it now stands they are going to try to put in that run during the rush hour only. Wheeling objected to moving the non rush hour service up there. We hope that might change. Regarding Saturday and Sunday service between Arlington Heights station and the west portion of the Village, RTA has developed a new plan with a new bus route to run Saturday and Sunday, summers only, to be established connecting the commercial area of historic Long Grove with the Arlington Heights station, via Arlington Heights Road. It would be instituted on a trial basis next year. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 8 - If there is sufficient ridership on Saturday and Sunday during the summer they would institute it year round. Our Transportation Commission is going to present to the RTA the thought that they might come into the Village and service some areas presently serviced by the bus with the new route. COMMUNICATIONS Commissioner Glover - At Monday night's Board Meeting they moved the Fiore Public Hearing from September 22, 1980 to October 13, 1980. Chesterfield and Trammel crow are proposing ajoint effort on the north east corner of Arlington Heights and Lake Cook for an office and commercial development. Commissioner Shifrin proposed a resolution for the Village Board. He had read within the last couple of weeks with great trepidation about the proposal of putting a supermarket in the Town Center. He is opposed to that and therefore presented the following resolution. "Whereas the Village of Buffalo Grove has a number of strip shopping centers and supermarkets at present; and Whereas the Town Center Ordinance was created to preserve the concept of a very unique type of environment; anri..whereas the Ordinance was drafted so that a supermarket was not a permitted use; and whereas a supermarket is not esthetically compatible with the concept of the Town Center; now therefore, be it resolved the Plan Commission opposes varying the current Ordinance to permit a supermarket and requests the Village Board to reject any plan involving a supermarket in the Town Cer.ter." The Vote AYES: Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Davis, Shifrin NAYES: Commissioners Glover, Reid ABSTAIN: Commissioners Kaszubawski ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon Commissioner Button - Regarding the property contemplated by the Fiore proposal, I believe, at this time, this is not in our Master Plan. Should we consider placing it in our Master Plan? Discussion Chairman Shields - In effect we are already doing it by considering it. Commissioner Goldspiel - The point is that we should have a plan on paper. It would be to our benefit to have it in our Master Plan. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980 - 9 - Commissioner Davis - I think we should direct the staff to add the Fiore property rt into the Master Plan. The Vote AYES: Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Davis, Shifrin, Glover, Reid, Kaszubowski NAPES: None ABSTAIN: None ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon FUTURE AGENDA The next meeting of the Plan Commission will be on September 17, 1980 and will have on its agenda the Master Plan and the Mueller Farm. Commissioner Kaszubowski moved that the meeting be adjourned. Commissioner Davis seconded the motion. Chairman Shields adjourned the meeting at 9:20 P.M. Respectfully submitted, t een Comer Recording Secretary APPROVED BY: 64;41140,/ Patrick Shields Chairman L Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting August 20, 1980