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2004-01-21 - Plan Commission - Minutes Board or Commission: ❑ Plan Commission Document Type: 0 A e g nda 0 Minutes Meeting ate: 01/21/2004 Type of Meeting: ❑ Regular Meeting REGULAR MEETING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION January 21, 2004 Proposed Bank of America facility, 55 Lake-Cook Road— Approval of a Preliminary Plan in the B-2 District—Workshop #1 Insignia Homes,Annexation with zoning in the R-8 District with a Residential Planned Unit Development (P.U.D.) and approval of a Preliminary plan for 41 townhomes, east side of Prairie Road across From Chestnut Terrace—Workshop #2 Chairman Ottenheimer called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. in the Village Council Chambers, Buffalo Grove Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove, Illinois. Commissioners present: Chairman Ottenheimer Mr. Samuels Mr. Smith Ms. Bocek Ms. Kenski-Sroka Mr. Khan Mr. Teplinsky Mr. Stark Mr. Cohn Commissioners absent: None Also present: Mr. Sidney Mathias, Attorney at Law Mr. Ray Gennedy, Gensler Mr. George Boddy, Jones Lang Lasalle Mr. Lawrence Freedman, Ash, Anos, Freedman& Logan Mr. John Green, Groundwork Ltd. Mr. Robert Pfeil, Village Planner Mr. Greg Summers, Associate Village Planner APPROVAL OF MINUTES Moved by Commissioner Kenski-Sroka, seconded by Commissioner Cohn to approve the minutes of the regular meeting of December 3, 2003. All Commissioners were in favor of the motion and the motion passed unanimously with Commissioners Bocek and Khan abstaining. COMMITTEE AND LIAISON REPORTS Commissioner Cohn attended the Village Board meeting on January 19, 2004 and stated the following items were discussed: 1. President Hartstein identified the goal of development of a five-year plan 2. Approval of a Special Use ordinance for the Gattone Sports Performance construction 3. Referral of a Park District proposal for a parking lot at the Alcott Center PROPOSED BANK OF AMERICA FACILITY, 55 LAKE COOK ROAD—APPROVAL OF A PRELIMINARY PLAN IN THE B-2 DISTRICT—WORKSHOP#1 Mr. Sidney Mathias stated the Village Board referred the proposed plan on November 17, 2003. The property is located at 55 Lake Cook Road at the corner of Lake Cook Road and Route 83. Bank of America would like to build a facility on this property which is in the B-2 District and is surrounded by commercial or business uses. He stated they have had a meeting with the appearance team. Mr. Ray Kennedy noted the items discussed in the ART meeting and the changes that had been made in response to the comments therein. He stated the first item was that the windows at the side elevation were too "punched" out looking. He noted what they did was to incorporate the same colors on the side elevation so that this side has a more unified look. Also they added a cast stone lintel at the top of the windows to make it more integrated to the overall scheme of the building. Item two, which stated that the storefront look needs to be modified, is an item the bank feels very strongly about maintaining. It is a part of getting light into the facility as well as the interior scheme and package and therefore this item has not been modified. Item three refers to the red aluminum canopy that is over the main entrance, which is a part of the marketing strategy of the bank. The comment was that it might be better to bring this down to earth tones. However, the bank's position is that it needs to be maintained red because it is part of their branding image. The next comment was that the rear of the building looks "separate". Mr. Kennedy stated they have now incorporated the cast stone into the building on the side and the rear so that the cast stone translates all the way around making a more unified facade on all sides of the building. Mr. Kennedy stated the next item noted the corners of the building need to be modified. He stressed that the bank desires to maintain the current conditions due to the aesthetics of the building here. Mr. Kennedy noted the ART team felt the drive thru was a very long expanse and suggested some additional columns be added. He noted the bank's position is that any additional columns become a security issue. Mr. Kennedy stated the last item noting roof signs are not permitted and stated they have now modified the sign as a wall mounted sign so it is attached to the building. Mr. Mathias noted there was an issue about ingress and egress on the property. He stated Lake Cook would remain the same with the right turn in and right turn out. However, the developers have now contacted IDOT to see about a full access on Route 83 directly across the street from the access to the medical center. He stated that while there has not been final approval from IDOT, they have been given favorable indication that this kind of access would be proper so that it would line up with the medical access. Commissioner Bocek asked if a fabric canopy was a possibility. Mr. Kennedy stated a fabric canopy would fade after a period of time whereas the metal canopy would be a lot more enduring. Commissioner Bocek stated a fabric awning is somewhat more upscale looking and gives the building more dimension. Commissioner Teplinsky stated he was at the ART meeting and the consensus was that this plan went a long way from the original one presented to the Village Board. However, a constant theme was that instead of going all the way from the contemporary look which was proposed to the Board to a more traditional look, there was a mix of elements. That was the tenor of the comment about the storefront appearance which it was felt had more of a contemporary look about it. Mr. Kennedy noted Bank of America's concept is that it is retail minded in its application so it is not traditional banking but more of a storefront operation with the openness of the layout. Commissioner Teplinsky stated there are a lot of developments in the Village, such as the Walgreens store, which when presented to the Village, it was noted that the design was part of their cookie cutter approach and no changes were possible. However, the Village knows by looking at surrounding communities that that is not necessarily always the case and does not have to be the case. Commissioner Teplinsky stated the red facility looks like one big red sign. If they are not willing to modify the color, perhaps they would be willing to get rid of the canopy entirely because it does not look very good aesthetically. Commission Cohn noted this property had been used as a gasoline station and he would like to make sure there were no outstanding environmental issues that might be holding up the redevelopment of the property. Mr. George Boddy stated BP Amoco did remove all their buildings as well as the tanks and the other mechanicals related to pumping of the gas. Commissioner Kenski-Sroka noted that she also feels that the canopy if out of line for this building. She noted other towns do not necessarily accept what corporations say they have to have and she does not find the red canopy lends anything to the design of the building. Commissioner Kenski-Sroka stated she also has an issue with the windows and does not like the storefront appearance. She further noted the drive-thru is too big of an expanse and it needs to be broken up in some way. If the columns are a security concern, there must be something that can be done that will not be a security concern, which is hard to believe at this particular location. Commissioner Kenski-Sroka noted the lack of response to the look of the rear of the building. Mr. Kennedy stated the bank is willing to go ahead and extend the roof around the rear of the building. That will then become a full roof. Commissioner Khan asked when we annexed this parcel which used to be in the Village of Wheeling and has Wheeling seen this proposal. Mr. Pfeil stated only a part of the parcel was disconnected from Wheeling to expedite the BP Amoco development. A portion of it was in Buffalo Grove originally. Wheeling is aware of this plan. The Village has not given Wheeling a copy of this version of the plan but subsequent to this workshop, Buffalo Grove staff will reinitiate contact with Wheeling to advise them concerning Buffalo Grove's planning process. Commissioner Khan asked if Wheeling is aware of the fact that this development will not create any sales tax for Wheeling benefit. Mr. Pfeil noted that Wheeling is aware of this proposal as there was one meeting that included their economic development director and they are aware of this non-retail use being proposed. Mr. Mathias stated that until they have more of a plan they did not want to go back and forth between Buffalo Grove and Wheeling. Therefore, when they get a read from this board they will present the plans to the Village of Wheeling for their approval. Commissioner Khan asked how far the negotiations have gone with IDOT for a full access on McHenry Road. Mr. Mathias stated they are in favor of the full access mainly because it is going to align with the curb cut across the street at the medical center. He further noted it is their understanding that there may be a future median which will actually make that a right in and right out at some point in the future. The bank is aware that that may happen down the road and is something they are willing to accept in order to be at this location. Commissioner Samuels asked if the cost of police and fire protection is being addressed for this location, as that is what was involved when Wheeling gave up its control over the intersection. Mr. Pfeil stated the Village would continue to have jurisdiction over the intersection so whatever property tax this development generates is the revenue that will flow to the Village. Mr. Mathias stated the site is vacant land right now so once this development is built there will be a benefit to the Village. Commissioner Samuels stated as far as he is concerned the only acceptable canopy would be one within the color palette of the remaining elements of the building. He also agrees that the roof should be extended but has no problem with the windows, drive-thru or corners. Commissioner Stark stated he does not have a problem with the canopy. However, he asked why the developer feels Buffalo Grove needs another bank. Mr. Mathias stated the bank has spent a lot of money doing demographics of areas and Bank of America is at the present time in an expansion mode and believes that this is a great community to have a facility. Commissioner Stark asked if there has ever been a history where Bank of America has had to close a branch due to reorganization or something like that. Mr. Boddy stated this is the bank's first foray into retail branch banking in Illinois. There have been times out in the west coast where a bank has had to be relocated. Commissioner Stark asked if this would be a viable branch due to the traffic pattern on this corner. Mr. Boddy noted this is the third BP Amoco site they are taking over. He further noted the bank has done demographic studies and they have a great deal of data on what works for them and is an economically feasible location. This is a growth market for them and they see it as an opportunity for a successful bank. Commissioner Smith asked this is not the ideal location due to access issues so why do they feel they will be successful here. Mr. Boddy stated the visibility is good here due to two highly busy intersections and given that they feel that the access is sufficient. Mr. Mathias stated the customers of the bank would obviously eventually figure out the best way to get to it otherwise they would not go to that bank. He further noted he is hearing some mixed messages from the Commission on the canopy issue and he wonders if he could get a polling on that issue. Chairman Ottenheimer called for polling on the canopy as to whether it is acceptable as proposed or if a change is necessary. The polling was as follows: Acceptable: Smith, Khan, Stark Change needed: Kenski-Sroka, Cohn, Teplinsky, Bocek, Samuels Chairman Ottenheimer noted there is a general consensus for a change. Chairman Ottenheimer asked if there would really be a need for the proposed 29 parking spaces even though only 18 are required by ordinance. He noted that cutting back on some of the parking spaces could perhaps facilitate more landscaping. Mr. Boddy stated it is the bank's standard to have 40 parking spaces when possible on a site. He further noted this particular site has a great deal of nature landscaping due to the creek. Commissioner Khan asked how many full time employees the bank would have. Mr. Boddy stated there would be between 10-12 employees. Commissioner Khan stated that 10-12 employees parking on site would mean that 29 spaces might be a good thing. Mr. Boddy stressed that typically all 12 employees are not there at the same time. Mr. Kennedy addressed the issue of the drive thru lanes. He stated it is the bank's interpretation that they have three lanes with two service points in each lane. The third lane is actually the ATM lane. In the bank's mind they feel they are single lanes that will work twice as fast so you have three lanes that will allow for the minimum 6 per lane stacking which would be 18 spots as opposed to the Commission's interpretation which would take that 6 times 6. This does work for the bank and they are comfortable with the queuing that is provided at this location. The Commission's consensus was that this matter is ready for a public hearing. INSIGNIA HOMES, ANNEXATION WITH ZONING IN THE R-8 DISTRICT WITH A RESIDENTIAL PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (P.U.D.) AND APPROVAL OF A PRELIMINARY PLAN FOR 41 TOWNHOMES, EAST SIDE OF PRAIRIE ROAD ACROSS FROM CHESTNUT TERRACE—WORKSHOP#2 Mr. John Green reviewed the original plan, which had 11 buildings and 41 units. He stated they have worked with the comments they received regarding that plan and the comments from the ART and the result was the new proposed plan. Mr. Green noted that building 11 which at the southwest corner of the site has been turned so that it now runs parallel to Chestnut Terrace. This eliminates the driveway in front of building 11 that had serviced four units off of a private driveway and now all of the units are serviced directly off of right of ways. He noted he has also looked at the spacing of some of the buildings. There is a provision in the ordinances of Buffalo Grove that says any building that is less than 24 feet apart in the multi-family building cannot have windows on the sides. He stated therefore he has shifted buildings 2 and 3 to be 24 feet from the north lot line and thus created 24 feet between buildings 1 and 2 and buildings 3 and 4. Mr. Green noted they have identified existing tree locations to be saved. They have been able to identify 16 different trees that are either in good or better than good condition. Most of the trees are around the perimeter of the site with a large number of them along the south side of the site and the east side of the side and a couple of them along the north side of the site. He stated they have designed the site plan so that the grading and setbacks and separations and fence design will work to save those trees. He noted there may be other trees in these general areas but what he is showing are the trees that are large enough under the ordinance that were required to be tagged and identified. He noted there appear to be several other small specimen trees in these general areas that have value and will hopefully be saved. He stated there is also a section of trees on the east side of the site that they are intending to save. These provide an excellent screen between part of the site and the railroad.. They have moved the building that was scheduled to be adjacent to the east so that that building is further away and have thereby eliminated any concern about keeping those trees along that portion of the site. Mr. Green stated they have agreed to flip buildings 6 and 7 so that the pattern of those buildings is the opposite hand of buildings 8 and 9 which eliminates any concerns over any possible monotony along that string of buildings. Mr. Green stated they have indicated a fence, which is not linear. Instead they have created a series of sections approximately 60 feet long running along Prairie Road and another series of pieces about 30 feet long set back approximately 12-15 feet from the first line of fencing. This way they stagger the fencing. The sections in between will be in the style of ornamental iron fencing so that the portions running parallel to Prairie Road would be board on board wood fencing and those running back you will be able to see through. In conjunction with that they have submitted a landscaping plan for consideration by the ART committee where they are letting the landscaping move back and forth within that fencing. They have also tilted buildings 1 and 2 and with the turning of building 11 they really have very little in the way of buildings coming up close to Prairie Avenue. By doing this they can create berming, save a number of trees along that streetscape and they have designed the spacing of the fencing to work with that. The sidewalk does not run parallel to the lot line all the way along; it actually shifts over at a couple of places. That is because they must dedicate about 20 feet of right of way along Prairie. Because that portion of the site is now front yard, some of the really nice trees are in that area and will now be in the right of way. Therefore they have designed a sidewalk to work around those trees. That way they can not only protect the trees but also increase the enhancement and overall feel of Prairie Road. Mr. Green stated they have included and incorporated a handicapped space on the site plan at the on street parking at the cul-de-sac and they have provided the crosswalk demarcation that would be necessary to work with that space. Because they are creating a recreational area directly across from that they felt it important to ensure it was accessible and serviceable by everyone who would want to participate in the recreation area. They have also relayed out the recreation area so that the walk meanders once you are in there. They have moved the gazebo so that is now in the space between buildings 3 and 4 so it can actually be seen from the road to the west, from the cul-de-sac, and when you are within the development and therefore has become a focal point. Mr. Green stated they now made the detention area a retention pond and is now a wet feature. There is a cell tower there with a lease until 2009. They have created a terraced island on which that cell tower will be located. They would put a fence around that and vertical evergreen material along the fence area and have created a double terrace down to the pond. The upper terrace would have flowers and the lower terrace would have wildflowers. They have also created a seating area in there. Mr. Green stated they have moved building 9 a little further to the west and they have shifted building 7 further west. By doing this they have been able to divert all of the overland flow to the north. Mr. Green noted they have now created a bikepath opportunity through the site and it now extends all the way from the south end of the site to the north end. Ultimately the opportunity is there for this bikepath to extend all the way up to Route 22. Mr. Green noted it has been requested that they prepare a traffic report with particular attention to the intersection and continuation of Avalon. It was also suggested that their information be shared with the Village traffic consultant and that the Village traffic consultant prepares an independent report. Both of those reports have now been completed and both indicate the same thing which is that the traffic demand for this particular development will be so low that there is no traffic designated or directed need for a connection. They indicate that the flows to and from Chestnut within this development will not seriously or significantly have any effect on Prairie Road. They also indicate that the old road traffic volumes created by this development would have very little impact on Prairie Road. Additionally the Fire Department has included a letter, which indicates it is their position and desire to have a full intersection, which is what the Fire Department usually likes to see. Mr. Green stated it is their program to create an emergency access. He stated they believe safety needs to be addressed and the opportunity to have an emergency flow through point can be created with a surface area of about 14 feet wide. That can either be connected or separated. It could be a connection with signage showing one way south only or one way north only, which would eliminate the opportunity to go south which would then be a policing issue. He noted they would explore any of the options if this were the direction the Plan Commission would desire. Mr. Green stated they have designed the project so that there is a cul-de-sac at the end of what is now a continuous Chestnut Terrace with the road that exists and heads to the north. This would be less than 500 feet long, which is not longer than that permitted by ordinance. Mr. Green reviewed the plans shown at the ART meeting and stated they have already modified some of the elements in response to feedback from that meeting. All four-unit types have different fronts so that when combined together there are four different facades on the one building. They are all the same materials and have all been designed to intermesh and have been designed so that they create bays where different units come together. He noted they would be doing two different color schemes. Mr. Green reviewed the landscape plan noting the plan has been developed to make sure they are maintaining and have the appropriate number of parkway trees not only on Prairie but also on all internal roads. In addition to that they will be creating a landscape program so that the entire site and all of the buildings will be landscaped. He stated they have to create a pathway to the retention area for service and therefore feel they may as well make it a pathway to make it easy for people to want to go back there and have a nice place for an overlook onto the retention pond. They are creating a sitting area with a paved area, benches, terraces and various landscaping to accent that. He further noted they have also chosen to create a large amount of berming along the south side of the site once they turn building 11 Commissioner Khan stated he would rather see an exclusive left turn lane in the north approach on Chestnut and a shared through lane in the right turn lane. Mr. Green stated they could accomplish that as they have a full 60-foot right of way so the opportunity is there to do so. Commissioner Khan stated he does not like to drink the water from a dead end water main and he notices there are a couple of places on the plan where the water is not looped and has a dead end. He stated he would rather see the main looped. Mr. Green stated he understands the point. Commissioner Khan asked who would maintain the island. Mr. Green stated there is a lease that goes with the cell tower property. He will have to explore that issue. Commissioner Khan stated he would prefer maintenance by the homeowner's association rather than the burden placed on the Village. Commissioner Teplinsky noted it appears that one of the conclusions made by KLOA in their traffic report is that 21 single-family homes would generate 200 daily trips while the proposed 41-townhouse development would generate 240 daily trips. He asked how that was arrived at. Mr. Green stated the differential is that the average population in a four bedroom single family home is about 3.9 people per household. The average population in a three-bedroom townhome is about 2.3 people per household. The number of trips is not necessarily related to just the number of people who drive but to servicing all the people in the population. As a result is that the total trips generated in a day would be very close. Commissioner Teplinsky noted the traffic study also seems to indicate that the a. m. peak hour delays will actually be less at the Half-Day Road and Prairie Road intersection under the proposed development than it is now. He asked how that could be. Mr. Green stated that is because they took counts on two days and not just one day. On one day the counts were different than on another day. That is actually an error, as they should have meshed them together. However, if they meshed them together you would get an average but if you look at the difference, the difference is just over one second. Commissioner Teplinsky noted the bottom line appears to be that although there are big problems there now, the proposed development will not add to the burden. Commissioner Stark noted that the counts were conducted in mid December and wondered if the counts would be different if they had been conducted somewhat earlier when more people were around. Mr. Green noted they purposely had them count while school was still in session. In addition to that they had been asked to have the counts done over a longer period of time and they therefore did a 3-hour count as opposed to a 2-hour count. He stated he would get a definitive answer to the question for the next meeting. Commissioner Stark asked if there is a reduction of public parking in the proposed plan from the original plan. Mr. Green stated there were 20 spaces on the first plan and there are now 18. One of the differences is that they are now been able to locate all of the parking so that it does not back out directly onto a public road. Commissioner Stark asked what portion of the school district would come from Buffalo Grove. Mr. Green stated a lot. Commissioner Stark asked what kind of emergency access would be provided for the Fire Department. Mr. Green stated the Fire Department has never shown any interest in grasscrete or any of those surfaces because of long term maintenance and settlement issues. So it would need to be a solid surface. Commissioner Stark asked who would maintain or bear the cost of maintaining that access. Mr. Green stated they are not putting it in a right of way so it would have to be part of the homeowner's association. Commissioner Samuels stated that in general he wants to integrate subdivisions instead of creating any kind of separations, especially artificial separations between subdivisions. He stated he feels it is very important that the street carry through for the convenience of the Fire Department and the school districts. Commissioner Cohn asked what would be in the recreational area of this development. Mr. Green stated they are planning for a larger than typical backyard scale piece of recreational equipment. In addition to that they are proposing a gazebo and they have also incorporated a paved area in the northwest with a seating area. Commissioner Smith asked when the cell tower would come down. Mr. Green stated the current lease runs through 2009. When the lease expires, the tower will be removed. Chairman Ottenheimer inquired concerning variations that would be requested. Mr. Green noted that the plan provides a 24-foot setback to the north property line, while the required P.U.D. standard is a 35-foot setback. Since the area to the north is planned for the same type of residential density, the 24-foot setback is appropriate. He stated they can put the buildings 15 feet together and not seek this variation, but they believe the development is much better with this variation. He further noted they would be seeking a front yard set back variation to a 25-foot minimum on each of the driveways. This is not inconsistent with what they have sought before. However, before they usually are on a 52-foot right of way and here they are maintaining the 60-foot right of way. He stated they would need a variation for the meandering sidewalk. He noted they would probably need to seek a side slope variation at the retention in order to create the terraces. They feel making this an amenity and a feature is important. He also noted he has not as yet explored potential side setbacks on buildings 1, 4 and 5. He stated they do not have lots and he will look to Mr. Pfeil to tell them if their side adjacent to Chestnut Terrace would be technically a variation or not. Also they are showing parking spaces in the center of the cul-de-sac and he is unclear whether that will require a variation. He noted that the proposed recreation area may or may not be considered in a front yard. It is not on the lot and therefore he is not sure if that will be a variation. Mr. Freedman stated they are prepared to build a plan with either a street connecting or not. Ultimately this will be a call for the Village. He stated they could either get a polling from the Commission as to their preference. That way they can bring one plan back or they can present both plans at the public hearing and ultimately let the matter be decided either at this level or by the board. Chairman Ottenheimer stated he would prefer if both plans were presented at the public hearing. Commissioner Khan asked how a snowplow truck would turn around on the proposed street. Mr. Green stated what they have done before is made a small paved T area so the opportunity exits to pull in and turn around and that would go away if the road were extended. Commissioner Khan asked what the depth of the water would be in the retention pond when it is at the high water level. Mr. Green stated the normal water level would be proposed to be 689.5 feet and the high water level would be 693.5 and the pond would have to be designed between 8-12 feet deep at the center. Commissioner Khan stated he would be concerned with the height of the retaining wall. Mr. Green stated he does not like high walls and these walls would be no more than 2-2 '/2 feet high at any given time. He stated they have a series of walls because he does not care for high walls and that is why they have created three terraces. Commissioner Khan noted the easternmost wall appears to be at least 4 feet tall. Mr. Green stated that one would end up being two walls. Commissioner Khan noted that if the depth of the water in the retention pond is that deep he would like to see a design that incorporates a bench that has at least 8-10 feet width. Mr. Green stated he understands. Commissioner Khan noted there are overhead lines on the property and asked if there is any Village ordinance that requires the developer to underground the overhead lines. Mr. Pfeil stated Village ordinance does not require a developer to bury existing overhead utility lines . Commissioner Khan stated he would like to at least see a cost estimate as to how much it would cost the developer to put those lines underground. Mr. Freedman stated Commonwealth Edison requires that they buy the lines and they charge prohibitively. Commissioner Cohn noted the main concern of the residents to the south was that the traffic on Prairie Road during the busy periods would go through the Mirielle neighborhood and then continue through this new development and then get back onto Prairie using this as a bypass. He asked if the traffic study addressed that issue. Mr. Green stated their traffic study did not address the issue. The Village traffic consultant did put into the report that if access were provided at this location it is their opinion that most residents would find it easier to access Prairie via Chestnut and therefore very little traffic would cut through the existing subdivision. Furthermore, they feel that if access were provided it would be a more desirable cut through route for existing residents of the subdivision to the south to travel to the north. Commissioner Cohn noted that does not address the pass through traffic on Prairie Road. Mr. Green noted the traffic study indicated the total amount of traffic was so little it did not matter. Trustee Trilling stated he was disappointed because the developers traffic study states that based upon the traffic impact analysis the proposed 41 townhomes will not have a major impact on the external public road system. He noted that does not make a real statement. On the other hand the Village traffic report states the road will have minimal impact on the surrounding roadway network. He noted he would like to see the developer's consultant readdress that issue. Mr. Green stated he would share this with the traffic consultant. Terry Moons, District 125 representative noted the high school buses would be picking students up on Prairie Road so the high school buses will not be going into the subdivision. The subdivision to the south is served by a different school district so the buses going into the Mirielle subdivision will not ever go into this subdivision because they are picking up students from a different school district. The part of Buffalo Grove that is in District 103 is those parts of Buffalo Grove that are north of Route 22 and east of Buffalo Grove Road. Those are the buses that will be coming in and at this point they are OK with the plan. Commissioner Samuels stated he would think the high school bus stopping on Prairie causes more of a traffic problem the bus stopping on Avalon and then stopping again on Avalon at the intersection before making a turn onto Prairie. Ms. Moons noted that if Avalon Drive were connected it would be an internal pickup. But if it is not connected the bus will stop on Prairie Road. Mr. David Sternberg, Mirielle subdivision, stated the residents in the subdivision have discussed with the developer and have indicated they would prefer that there not be any pass through from Avalon going through Mirielle to the new development. However, recognizing the needs of the Fire Department and Police Department, they are agreeable to some kind of a pass through but with the limitation that the developer discussed about there being some kind of a construction so that it is not an open through way. He noted there are primarily young families with lots of little kids in this subdivision and noted there is a large traffic backup from Route 22 going south toward Aptakisic. Therefore if there is an opportunity to avoid that backup to catch the train people will use a street that bypasses the backup. This traffic will be at the same time that kids are out going to school. Mr. Jay Dhesi, stated he agrees with Mr. Sternberg's comments and asked that the Commission keep this in mind when it comes to the public hearing. The Commission agreed this matter was ready for public hearing. CHAIRMAN'S REPORT—None FUTURE AGENDA SCHEDULE Mr. Pfeil said the next meeting is scheduled for February 4, 2004. PUBLIC COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS—None STAFF REPORT—None NEW BUSINESS—None ADJOURNMENT Moved by Commissioner Teplinsky, seconded by Commissioner Khan and carried unanimously to adjourn. Chairman Ottenheimer adjourned the meeting at 9:44 p.m. Respectfully submitted, Fay Rubin, Recording Secretary APPROVED BY: LESTER OTTENHEIMER, Chair