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1982-11-18 - Appearance Commission - Minutes APPEARANCE COMMISSION VILLAGE OF BUFFALO GROVE, IL. THURS. , NOV. 18, 1982 I. CALL TO ORDER Chairman Don Hardt called the meeting to order at 7:40 P.M. on Thursday, November. 18, 1982 at the Village Hall . He apologized for the inconvenience caused last week by absence of Commissioners. II. ROLL CALL Commissioners Present: C. Zusel , E. Larsen and D. Hardt. QUORUM Commissioners Absent: L. Gibbs, C. Cea and K. Krippes. Bldg., Dept. - Mr. Dominic J. Saviano, Deputy Bldg. Commissioner Trustee Liaison - Mr. Charles Gerschefske III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES October 28, 1982 - Postponed because of absence of Commissioners who attended that meeting. IV. BUSINESS Order of published Agenda was changed to accomodate Jewel/Osco representative, because he must attend another meeting. A. (NEW BUSINESS) - Jewel/Osco Wall Signs It was noted that a variation was granted on Oct. 19, 1982 to allow the four signs requested by Jewel/Osco to erect Drug/Food over each entrance. Mr. Tim Schwartz presented the signs and stated that because there is much opposition to the Liquor sign requested, the Osco Company has decided not to pursue the issue. Com. Larsen made the following motion: I move we approve the Jewel/Osco petition; identified as Exhibit "A having been granted a variation by the ZBA to allow: 1 . Letter size to be 8'72" for Jewel/Osco 2. Two readings of Drug/Food over each entrance-way; letters to be 21 inches high. Com. Zusel seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Zusel Larsen Hardt Nay - None *„/ Motion Passed 3 to 0. A. (OLD BUSINESS) - Artists' Frame Service, Inc. - Pylon and Wall Sign Mr. Jay Goltz, Owner of Artists ' Frame Service, Inc. and Mr. Bob Pavetto, State Farm Insurance Agency and owner of Buffalo Court Center were present to make the request for the change of the insert of the pylon sign from "Got the Picture" and to request wall signs for both businesses. Com. Larsen reviewed the signage, presented at two previous meetings. He noted that Mr. Goltz has changed the name of his business from "Got The Picture" to Artists' Frame Service, Inc. Factory Outlet - Picture Framing and has changed his business license to read the same. The insert will be Maroon on a Grey Background, with the lower portion in reversed colors. In addition, Mr. Goltz requested a wall sign of less than 20% of the fascia and Mr. Pavetto requested a similiar sign over his entrance. Mr. Goltz presented a photograph of the building and dimensions were given as 8' x 22' or 176 square feet. Ch. Hardt stated that the Buffalo Court Center is unique in that it was granted the four free-standing signs, with the stipulation that no wall signs would be requested. On other occasions, the owner has been asked to develop a sign package for the Center. Mr. Pavetto said he did not need to do so because the pylons would be sufficient. But now, if he is re- questing wall signs, it will be necessary to decide what possible future needs might be. Some restrictions should be developed. Mr. Goltz explained that when he rented his store, the three pylon signs were already there, and the simplest way to acquire signage was to put up the fourth sign. He was granted a ZBA variation to do so. But because customers cannot locate the business. He has changed the name because he no longer has pictures, only frames. The business location in Buffalo Grove has not done well . Traffic along Dundee Road is moving too fast for people to see the pylon. It is more difficult to advertise in the suburbs. The size of the four pylons is approximately 100 square feet, measured as the Code directs. Each sign is 61 " x 53" - about 22 square feet. Com. Larsen noted that the Code allows wall signage of 20% as well as ground signage of 120 square feet. Ch. Hardt stated the Code allows only one ground sign per parcel that that is for identification of the Center only, not the individual businesses. Therefore, a compromise was made when the other ground signs were allowed. He also questioned the value of a wall sign, because Mr. Goltz has had a large amount of lighted neon signs in his window to attract customers. Mr. Goltz said that is the reason he put the neon signs up, and they do help, but people do not look for his kind of business in a building of that appearance. It looks more like a professional building. Even a sign man told him he has a problem! He is open to discussion. Mr. Pavetto stated he felt that wall signs would help both businesses. The other two tenants do not want to put up wall signs. He said he was 4j willing to develop a sign package. The Vincent Sign Co. does nice work, he will ask for his direction. Mr. Pavetto said he thought approval was given to Mr. Goltz at a prior meeting and that to balance the appearance, he is willing to put up a sign. APPEARANCE COMMISSION Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Two Ch. Hardt requested that some restrictions be developed for the Center. The possiblity of a third sign being requested was discussed. Mr. Pavetto asked if the AC would approve a third sign, without a fourth? He said he could put it in writing to the other tenants, that should either of them desire a sign, both would have to order at the same time. A sign is a good marketable item. When businesses vacate signs are sold to the new tenant. Ch. Hardt said he was thinking of Mr. Pavetto's position and the hardship such a decision would cause, should at a future time a third tenant need a sign. It is not a question of whether the AC would allow it, but what does Mr. Pavetto want. It is his center. The AC tries to foresee problems and prevent them. Com. Zusel said she would approve the wall sign now and would like to have a sign package developed for each business to have a sign. Com. Larsen said he felt additional signage is needed, from a business point of view. He thought Century 21 could get a sign for about $700.00 - but he is in favor of a sign package for the center so all signs would match in size and continuity. All signage must be approved by the owner first, then by the AC. The two signs requested are acceptable. Mr. Pavetto said he would prefer can signs with flexibility of inserts. Each tenant owns the pylon sign. The sign package should include some restrictions and some requirments should a tenant move out. Ch. Hardt suggested reviewing other sign packages. Grove Court has can signs. So does Ranch Mart. These two are the only ones in B.G. Copies are available. Approval of the change in pylon could be granted at this time, but before wall signs are approved, a sign package must be presented. Mr. Goltz stated he has already been before the AC 3 times, he needs a wall sign before Christmas. He wants the center to look good and he wants his sign to look good. Ch. Hardt questioned whether a variation would be required because the Sign Code does not allow 4 separate ground signs on one parcel . Mr. Saviano noted that the Sign Code allows one pylon if it does not exceed 120 square feet. Wall signs are allowed up to 20% of the total fascia area. The pylon signs are legal because they have been issued permits. Com. Larsen stated to to prolong this issue would be creating a hardship for both Mr. Goltz and Mr. Pavetto. It was his feeling that the ground signs are too low to be seen, especially for traffic coming from the West because of the trees. After further discussion, the size of the wall signs presented was found to be higher than the Code allows. The height of the fascia above the arch is 8 feet and therefore a 4 foot sign would comply. The signs presented are 5 x 7 feet, totaling 35 square feet. They would be allowed a somewhat longer sign but it can only be 4 feet in height: 4' x 8' or 3' x 10' were suggested. The space would allow about 36 square feet. Mr. Goltz agreed that he wants a good looking sign. He wants it to be readable. The plan submitted is clean copy. The Vincent Sign Company will be consulted. He does want his whole name included on the sign. The State Farm copy was addressed and because it has been historical to L./ prohibit phone numbers, Mr. Pavetto was advised that the sign would give him more publicity if his name were larger. People would have no problem getting the phone number. APPEARANCE COMMISSION Nov.-18, 1982 - Page Three Ch. Hardt directed Mr. Pavetto to select a size for the sign cans, restrict background color and select 2 to 3 other colors to be used on the signs; write up a sign package possibly restricting neon window signs. The Sign Package should include future signage. Mr. Goltz said he needs signage, and he would accept approval of the ground sign; then come back with the new copy in December. Com.Larsen made the following motion: I move we approve the face change for Artists' Frame Service, Inc. Factory Outlet-Picture Framing - as presented for the pylon sign; as per Section 14.28.030 A of the Sign Code. The sign being no less in conformance, than the existing sign. Con. Zusel seconded ;the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Zusel Larsen Motion Passed 2 to 1 . Nay - Hardt Buffalo Court Sign Package will be placed on the Dec. 9, 1982 Agenda. V. BUSINESS - NEW A. Jewel/Osco - Mr. Harold Eisenberg, Mr. Doyle and Mr. Russo from Doyle Signs requested a slight change in The Grove on the pylon sign. Mr. Russo explained that the sign as approved cannot be fabricated. The small size of the stroke will not allow the green color to be seen, because there is not enough vaporization of the mercury in cold weather. The original sign would have been metal letters with neon lighting that would wash the background with light. The new proposal will be green plastic letters, with the lighting inside the letters to be white neon. Com. Zusel made the following motion: I move we approve The Grove ground sign with changes specified and submitted for the fabrication of The Grove reading. Com. Larsen seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Larsen Zusel Hardt Motion Passed 3 to 0. Nay - None B. Village Plaza Ms. Kathleen Sentkowski and Ms. Marilyn Metler presented the proposed addition of "400" to the existing Village Plaza pylon sign in dark brown color. Com. Zusel suggested adding 'W" to indicate 400 W. Dundee Road for better identification. Ms. Metier said they would prefer to have '400' for now and then if another change was desired, they would return. APPEARANCE COMMISSION Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Four Com. Zusel made the following motion: I move we approve the addition of '400' to the pylon sign at Village Plaza, under Sec. 14.28.030 A as submitted. Com. Larsen seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Larsen Zusel Hardt Nay - None Motion Passed 3 to 0. With regard to request of possible small pylon signs in front of each store, Ch. Hardt said they would need a variation; and added that the AC would be against them. C. Striker Lanes - Discussion of Pylon The owner could not be present tonight, Mr. Saviano described the changes that are being considered. Replacement of the Mr. Adams man with the B.G. Logo Buffalo. On reader board part, the Pro-Bowler Shop would be identi- fied. Ch. Hardt suggested getting new letters for the reader board. The AC felt the reader board is a good means of listing attractions. Mr. Saviano informed the Commission that Dr. Lauter had called to ask for a new pylon sign. He plans to take down the two existing poles and the new sign would be much more attractive. Mr. Saviano questioned the need for a ZBA variation. The new sign would be too close to The Arbors, but it if the interpretation of a temporary sign vs. a permenent sign, is made that give permanent signage preference, then Dr. Lauter would not need a variation. Mr. Frank Hruby will review the situation and give the interpretation. Dr. Lauter should not be penalized because of the over-sight allowing temporary signage until all units are sold or rented. D. Wolke's Coats, Etc. - Plaza Verde Sign submitted meets all criteria of the Plaza Verde Sign Package, so the administrator issued the permit. VI. WORKSHOP Sign Code Discussion. Postponed until December 9, 1982. Hopefully all AC Commissioners will be present. VII. ADJOURNMENT Com. Larsen made a motion to adjourn. Com. Zusel seconded the motion. Chairman Hardt adjourned the meeting at 9:15 P.M. Respectfully submitted, -4<(2 Shirley Bates, cretary sb APPEARANCE COMMISSION Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Five