1982-11-18 - Appearance Commission - Minutes APPEARANCE COMMISSION
VILLAGE OF BUFFALO GROVE, IL.
THURS. , NOV. 18, 1982
I. CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Don Hardt called the meeting to order at 7:40 P.M. on Thursday,
November. 18, 1982 at the Village Hall . He apologized for the inconvenience
caused last week by absence of Commissioners.
II. ROLL CALL
Commissioners Present: C. Zusel , E. Larsen and D. Hardt. QUORUM
Commissioners Absent: L. Gibbs, C. Cea and K. Krippes.
Bldg., Dept. - Mr. Dominic J. Saviano, Deputy Bldg. Commissioner
Trustee Liaison - Mr. Charles Gerschefske
III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
October 28, 1982 - Postponed because of absence of Commissioners who
attended that meeting.
IV. BUSINESS
Order of published Agenda was changed to accomodate Jewel/Osco representative,
because he must attend another meeting.
A. (NEW BUSINESS) - Jewel/Osco Wall Signs
It was noted that a variation was granted on Oct. 19, 1982 to allow the
four signs requested by Jewel/Osco to erect Drug/Food over each entrance.
Mr. Tim Schwartz presented the signs and stated that because there is
much opposition to the Liquor sign requested, the Osco Company has decided
not to pursue the issue.
Com. Larsen made the following motion:
I move we approve the Jewel/Osco petition;
identified as Exhibit "A having been
granted a variation by the ZBA to allow:
1 . Letter size to be 8'72" for
Jewel/Osco
2. Two readings of Drug/Food over
each entrance-way; letters to
be 21 inches high.
Com. Zusel seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Zusel
Larsen
Hardt
Nay - None
*„/ Motion Passed 3 to 0.
A. (OLD BUSINESS) - Artists' Frame Service, Inc. - Pylon and Wall Sign
Mr. Jay Goltz, Owner of Artists ' Frame Service, Inc. and Mr. Bob
Pavetto, State Farm Insurance Agency and owner of Buffalo Court Center
were present to make the request for the change of the insert of the
pylon sign from "Got the Picture" and to request wall signs for both
businesses.
Com. Larsen reviewed the signage, presented at two previous meetings.
He noted that Mr. Goltz has changed the name of his business from
"Got The Picture" to Artists' Frame Service, Inc. Factory Outlet -
Picture Framing and has changed his business license to read the same.
The insert will be Maroon on a Grey Background, with the lower portion
in reversed colors.
In addition, Mr. Goltz requested a wall sign of less than 20% of the
fascia and Mr. Pavetto requested a similiar sign over his entrance.
Mr. Goltz presented a photograph of the building and dimensions were
given as 8' x 22' or 176 square feet.
Ch. Hardt stated that the Buffalo Court Center is unique in that it was
granted the four free-standing signs, with the stipulation that no wall
signs would be requested. On other occasions, the owner has been asked
to develop a sign package for the Center. Mr. Pavetto said he did not need
to do so because the pylons would be sufficient. But now, if he is re-
questing wall signs, it will be necessary to decide what possible future
needs might be. Some restrictions should be developed.
Mr. Goltz explained that when he rented his store, the three pylon signs
were already there, and the simplest way to acquire signage was to put
up the fourth sign. He was granted a ZBA variation to do so. But because
customers cannot locate the business. He has changed the name because he
no longer has pictures, only frames. The business location in Buffalo
Grove has not done well . Traffic along Dundee Road is moving too fast for
people to see the pylon. It is more difficult to advertise in the suburbs.
The size of the four pylons is approximately 100 square feet, measured
as the Code directs. Each sign is 61 " x 53" - about 22 square feet.
Com. Larsen noted that the Code allows wall signage of 20% as well as
ground signage of 120 square feet.
Ch. Hardt stated the Code allows only one ground sign per parcel that
that is for identification of the Center only, not the individual businesses.
Therefore, a compromise was made when the other ground signs were allowed.
He also questioned the value of a wall sign, because Mr. Goltz has had a
large amount of lighted neon signs in his window to attract customers.
Mr. Goltz said that is the reason he put the neon signs up, and they do
help, but people do not look for his kind of business in a building of
that appearance. It looks more like a professional building. Even a
sign man told him he has a problem! He is open to discussion.
Mr. Pavetto stated he felt that wall signs would help both businesses.
The other two tenants do not want to put up wall signs. He said he was
4j willing to develop a sign package. The Vincent Sign Co. does nice work,
he will ask for his direction. Mr. Pavetto said he thought approval was
given to Mr. Goltz at a prior meeting and that to balance the appearance,
he is willing to put up a sign.
APPEARANCE COMMISSION
Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Two
Ch. Hardt requested that some restrictions be developed for the Center.
The possiblity of a third sign being requested was discussed. Mr. Pavetto
asked if the AC would approve a third sign, without a fourth? He said he
could put it in writing to the other tenants, that should either of them
desire a sign, both would have to order at the same time. A sign is a good
marketable item. When businesses vacate signs are sold to the new tenant.
Ch. Hardt said he was thinking of Mr. Pavetto's position and the hardship
such a decision would cause, should at a future time a third tenant need a
sign. It is not a question of whether the AC would allow it, but what does
Mr. Pavetto want. It is his center. The AC tries to foresee problems and
prevent them.
Com. Zusel said she would approve the wall sign now and would like to have
a sign package developed for each business to have a sign.
Com. Larsen said he felt additional signage is needed, from a business point
of view. He thought Century 21 could get a sign for about $700.00 - but he
is in favor of a sign package for the center so all signs would match in
size and continuity. All signage must be approved by the owner first, then
by the AC. The two signs requested are acceptable.
Mr. Pavetto said he would prefer can signs with flexibility of inserts.
Each tenant owns the pylon sign. The sign package should include some
restrictions and some requirments should a tenant move out.
Ch. Hardt suggested reviewing other sign packages. Grove Court has can
signs. So does Ranch Mart. These two are the only ones in B.G. Copies
are available. Approval of the change in pylon could be granted at this
time, but before wall signs are approved, a sign package must be presented.
Mr. Goltz stated he has already been before the AC 3 times, he needs a wall
sign before Christmas. He wants the center to look good and he wants his
sign to look good.
Ch. Hardt questioned whether a variation would be required because the Sign
Code does not allow 4 separate ground signs on one parcel .
Mr. Saviano noted that the Sign Code allows one pylon if it does not exceed
120 square feet. Wall signs are allowed up to 20% of the total fascia area.
The pylon signs are legal because they have been issued permits.
Com. Larsen stated to to prolong this issue would be creating a hardship
for both Mr. Goltz and Mr. Pavetto. It was his feeling that the ground
signs are too low to be seen, especially for traffic coming from the
West because of the trees.
After further discussion, the size of the wall signs presented was found
to be higher than the Code allows. The height of the fascia above the arch
is 8 feet and therefore a 4 foot sign would comply. The signs presented are
5 x 7 feet, totaling 35 square feet. They would be allowed a somewhat
longer sign but it can only be 4 feet in height: 4' x 8' or 3' x 10' were
suggested. The space would allow about 36 square feet.
Mr. Goltz agreed that he wants a good looking sign. He wants it to be
readable. The plan submitted is clean copy. The Vincent Sign Company
will be consulted. He does want his whole name included on the sign.
The State Farm copy was addressed and because it has been historical to
L./ prohibit phone numbers, Mr. Pavetto was advised that the sign would give
him more publicity if his name were larger. People would have no problem
getting the phone number.
APPEARANCE COMMISSION
Nov.-18, 1982 - Page Three
Ch. Hardt directed Mr. Pavetto to select a size for the sign cans,
restrict background color and select 2 to 3 other colors to be used
on the signs; write up a sign package possibly restricting neon window
signs. The Sign Package should include future signage.
Mr. Goltz said he needs signage, and he would accept approval of the ground
sign; then come back with the new copy in December.
Com.Larsen made the following motion:
I move we approve the face change for
Artists' Frame Service, Inc. Factory
Outlet-Picture Framing - as presented
for the pylon sign; as per Section
14.28.030 A of the Sign Code. The
sign being no less in conformance,
than the existing sign.
Con. Zusel seconded ;the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Zusel
Larsen
Motion Passed 2 to 1 . Nay - Hardt
Buffalo Court Sign Package will be placed on the Dec. 9, 1982 Agenda.
V. BUSINESS - NEW
A. Jewel/Osco - Mr. Harold Eisenberg, Mr. Doyle and Mr. Russo from
Doyle Signs requested a slight change in The Grove on the pylon sign.
Mr. Russo explained that the sign as approved cannot be fabricated.
The small size of the stroke will not allow the green color to be seen,
because there is not enough vaporization of the mercury in cold weather.
The original sign would have been metal letters with neon lighting that
would wash the background with light. The new proposal will be green
plastic letters, with the lighting inside the letters to be white neon.
Com. Zusel made the following motion:
I move we approve The Grove ground sign
with changes specified and submitted for
the fabrication of The Grove reading.
Com. Larsen seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Larsen
Zusel
Hardt
Motion Passed 3 to 0. Nay - None
B. Village Plaza
Ms. Kathleen Sentkowski and Ms. Marilyn Metler presented the proposed
addition of "400" to the existing Village Plaza pylon sign in dark
brown color.
Com. Zusel suggested adding 'W" to indicate 400 W. Dundee Road for
better identification.
Ms. Metier said they would prefer to have '400' for now and then if
another change was desired, they would return.
APPEARANCE COMMISSION
Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Four
Com. Zusel made the following motion:
I move we approve the addition of
'400' to the pylon sign at Village
Plaza, under Sec. 14.28.030 A as
submitted.
Com. Larsen seconded the motion. Roll Call Vote: Aye - Larsen
Zusel
Hardt
Nay - None
Motion Passed 3 to 0.
With regard to request of possible small pylon signs in front of each
store, Ch. Hardt said they would need a variation; and added that the
AC would be against them.
C. Striker Lanes - Discussion of Pylon
The owner could not be present tonight, Mr. Saviano described the changes
that are being considered. Replacement of the Mr. Adams man with the B.G.
Logo Buffalo. On reader board part, the Pro-Bowler Shop would be identi-
fied.
Ch. Hardt suggested getting new letters for the reader board. The AC
felt the reader board is a good means of listing attractions.
Mr. Saviano informed the Commission that Dr. Lauter had called to ask
for a new pylon sign. He plans to take down the two existing poles and
the new sign would be much more attractive. Mr. Saviano questioned the
need for a ZBA variation. The new sign would be too close to The Arbors,
but it if the interpretation of a temporary sign vs. a permenent sign,
is made that give permanent signage preference, then Dr. Lauter would
not need a variation. Mr. Frank Hruby will review the situation and give
the interpretation. Dr. Lauter should not be penalized because of the
over-sight allowing temporary signage until all units are sold or rented.
D. Wolke's Coats, Etc. - Plaza Verde
Sign submitted meets all criteria of the Plaza Verde Sign Package, so
the administrator issued the permit.
VI. WORKSHOP
Sign Code Discussion. Postponed until December 9, 1982. Hopefully all AC
Commissioners will be present.
VII. ADJOURNMENT
Com. Larsen made a motion to adjourn. Com. Zusel seconded the motion.
Chairman Hardt adjourned the meeting at 9:15 P.M.
Respectfully submitted,
-4<(2
Shirley Bates, cretary
sb APPEARANCE COMMISSION
Nov. 18, 1982 - Page Five