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1973-03-14 - Plan Commission - Minutes} 1 . 4,4 3/14/73 ;11n .1 �, MINUTES OF THE BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION Y PUBLIC HEARING - HAWTHORN PROPERTY (continuation) HELD ON MARCH 14 , 1973 Chairman, Carl Genrich, called the meeting to order at 8 :17 P.M. on March 14 , 1973 . Commissioners Present: Mr. Genrich, Chairman Mr. Yost Mr. Haarr Mr. Harris Mr. Mendenhall Mr . VanEngen Mr. Gamm Mr. Keister Mr. Fader Commissioners Absent: Mrs. Rech Mr. Shields Also present were Mr. Arnold Seaberg, Village Engineer, Mr. William Dettmer, Building Commissioner, and Mr. Leo Passato of School Dis- trict #102. Mr. Beaubian introduced into the record, all Exhibits alluded to in the Annexation Agreement and the revised Annexation Agreement. He stated that the original Agreement mentioned Exhibit "E" , but it was still not available so it was spelled out in the Agreement. Mr. Lacy presented a Zoning Plat showing the zoning surrounding the property and the existing zoning of the property in question and what they are requesting. He stated that they are requesting B-3 for 5. 2 acres and B-2 for approximately one acre. They are also requesting B-3 for another parcel of 12 .8 acres, R-9 for the "strip" which is 2. 64 acres, R-9 PUD Special Use for 124 acres, and M-1 for 49 acres of industrial . Mr. Beaubian testified that Lots 8 and 11 are presently farm land, Lot 12 is commercial with a nursery located on it, Lot 13 is single- family residential with a single family home on it, the 124 acres has a farm on it, and the manufacturing parcel is presently vacant. Mr. Beaubian stated that the street shown running north and south through the project will connect with Horatio Boulevard in Horatio Gardens. Mr. Gingold stated that Exhibit 40 (C) shows the school site. He said they are in agreement with the School District. There will be 24 .72 acres of school/park land. The school requires 8 acres, the lake is 3 . 2 acres, leaving 13 acres of actual useable land. Commissioner Harris asked Mr. Hooper if the drainage would take up all of the open space. Mr. Hooper stated the drainage channels will be 10-12 feet wide and the strips of land are 120-150 feet wide. �1 3/14/73 Commissioner VanEngen asked them to strike the last sentence in `./ Paragraph 11, Page 5, but Mr. Beaubian asked to be allowed to re- word it. Mr. Gingold distributed the Tax Impact Study. Mr. Sheridan said they met with School Districts 102 and 125. They also met with representatives of the Park District and have requested `,/ a meeting with the Park Board as soon as possible, but the Park Board did not feel it necessary to meet with the developer prior to this meeting. Mr. Gingold said that, regarding bedroom percentages, they are trying to get as much flexibility as they can. They would like to maintain total flexibility but also work out a satisfactory arrangement with the School Board so they are not overburdened. He said they would work this out with the School Board and if they feel the impact would be too great, they would try to satisfy them. Commissioner Harris said he does not feel another body should speak for the Village; and you are saying the School District should tell us if it is alright. Commissioner Mendenhall stated that if they bring in more three-bedroom units than we would like, they would alter the character of the Village because they sell for very little more than the two-bedroom units. Commissioner Haarr said we are looking for specific percentages, but if the market is not what you expected now, you can come back to us to change it. Mr. Gingold said he is still not comfortable enough about the market to tie them down to specifics. Commissioner Haarr said he is not comfortable with no specifics since the bedroom count is the only real control we have on the best interests of the Village. Mr. Gingold said the first neighborhood is a good indication of what we plan to build throughout the entire development, but that he is not prepared to lock in any figures other than the first neighborhood. Commissioner Fader asked why they objected to being held to the figures listed in the minutes of March 7? Mr. Gingold stated this is a six-year project and they do not feel they can tie themselves down without any experience. After the first year of sales experience, perhaps they would know better what the mar- ket demands will be. Commissioner Fader said that what might be beneficial to them as a developer, may not be beneficial to us. Chairman Genrich said that if they cannot come up with some limits, the Plan Commission will probably make a percentage suggestion to the Village Board. We have to try to build some limits into the project which will be workable. Mr. Gingold said they do not want to make a restriction, but will let the Plan Commission recommend to the Village Board what they feel would be an appropriate mix. Commissioner Harris said it would be difficult to pick out a number. Mr. Gingold stated he was suggesting they recommend a percentage 3/14/73 variation such as, not varying 20% for the total project. Comm- issioner Yost said the concern is the number of three-bedroom town- houses, which produce the most children, so how about switching some of these three-bedrooms to more condominium three-bedrooms. Mr. Gingold said they cannot do this. Mr. Beaubian said, regarding the rewording in the Agreement, the Exhibit is built to scale and if it meets your standards, recommend it to the Village Board and if it does not, reject it and we will have to try to work this out. After further discussion, the word "shall" was changed to "must" . The developer stated they are asking for the variations required to construct a service station on the one-acre commercial parcel. Commissioner Haarr said they would have to have four (4) acres to ask for B-2 zoning. Mr. Beaubian said they are requesting B-2 and the Plan Commission can make a recommendation requesting a var- iation. Commissioner Haarr asked why they picked that site? Mr. Beaubian said it is on an intersection and Weiland Road could con- ceivably be widened to four lanes and we feel it is an ideal site for a service station. Commissioner Harris asked why they did not run that road straight. You have created a piece of property which you may not be able to build on. Mr. Johnston said this just seemed to be the most logical solution and it enables us to run the road into Weiland at a 90 degree angle. Commissioner Harris stated this is surrounded by residential and you are asking to stick a dot of commercial in the middle of it. Mr. Johnston said this is a semi-major entrance to the development. Mr . Gingold said the parcel of property between there and Lake-Cook Road is bound to go commercial on up to this parcel. Commissioner Harris said you can- not be sure of that. Mr. Gingold said they are anticipating this and want this to be commercial because of this. Chairman Genrich asked Mr. Dettmer to give some comments on the fire protection. Mr. Dettmer said he is presently setting up a conference with the Fire Officials who will be setting up the pro- tection for this area. It was discovered that this will fall into the Long Grove Fire District. These Officials are from the Long Grove and Buffalo Grove Fire Districts and the meeting is an effort to have this area annexed into the Buffalo Grove Fire District. The "strip" is the only area not contiguous to the Buffalo Grove/ Wheeling Fire District, and there is one small parcel in the indus- trial area which is in the Vernon Fire District. The Fire Chief of that District has agreed that, if the parcel is not large enough to be to their advantage, he will sign the papers necessary to have it annexed to the Buffalo Grove District, but if it is large, he will not want to relinquish it. Commissioner Haarr asked Mr. Dettmer about access to the 5-story building. Mr. Dettmer said he has looked at this and to use the truck we now have, we need to get within 55 feet of the building and there is one side we cannot get to. This is not acceptable 3/14/73 and will have to be worked out. We will need a 10-foot fire lane capable of holding the fire apparatus. This capability has to be determined by Mr. Seaberg. Commissioner Haarr asked Mr. Gingold if they were willing to work this out with the Fire Department and he stated he would be. Commissioner Haarr stated he had requested a change in the reversion clause and this was not made. Mr. Beaubian said the Lake County Industrial Zoning for the property is the middle of the three zon- ing districts they have. He said they are requesting M-1 and this will allow them to build similar to the zoning they now have in the County. He said it is very conceivable they would not build this area by the end of five years. Commissioner Haarr suggested we could write the reversion clause to revert to M-1. Mr. Beaubian said this is something the Village Board and the Village Attorney should work out. Chairman Genrich asked what their reaction would be if we recommend the Manufacturing District plans be brought in when you are ready to build? Mr. Beaubian said he did not think we could do that. Commissioner Haarr asked if they would agree to coming in under R-8 since R-9 may not be in existence much longer. The main difference would be the height restriction which would be three (3) stories or 35 feet. Mr. Gingold said they do not want any- thing more restrictive than what they now have. He suggested we give them the variations under R-8 to meet the height they are requesting. Commissioner Haarr said we cannot waiver more than 10 fieet on height, which would be 3-1/2 feet. 4jv Commissioner VanEngen suggested that, regarding the reversion clause, we leave it up to the Village Board O Zoning Board in five years because we may come up with a new zoning classification in five years which would better fit what they are asking. Comm- issioner Haarr said, if in five years we have the same book in front of us, do you want to give them R-9 with no Special Use? Mr. Gin- gold said all they are asking is that whatever Ordinance is in exis- tence at that time that conforms to County UR-9, will be what this property will revert to. Commissioner Harris asked Mr. Hooper how they intended to conform to our Ordinance for Retention? Mr. Hooper said it would be the same as proposed for the Otis property. Comm. Harris said there is not retention lake so how are you going to take care of the Village requirement? Also, is the lake they plan only for looks or is it part of the retention? Mr. Hooper said most of the re- tention will be done within neighborhood "B" , which will be the first one to be constructed. Your Ordinance can be met by ponding within the green areas, not to exceed one foot. He said the storm here last night would only get these areas damp and you would not have water standing there. Comm. Harris asked, then how have you retained any water? It would all run off this property. Mr. 3/14/73 Hooper said he doubts that there would have been any runoff from this area last night. Commissioner Harris said it has to go some- where and this seems like a poor way to do it. There will be puddles for children to play in and get muddy and grass will not grow there. Mr. Seaberg said there have been no Engineering Plans submitted. Commissioner Harris said that, regarding the grading of these areas, a landscaper could disturb this grade and we will have people complaining at the meetings about standing water everywhere. Mr. Seaberg said the drainage tiles will carry away water from a two-year storm and anything more than that will create ponding in the green areas. Commissioner Yost said this Ordinance was taken from the MSD Ordinance which requires a centralized retention or detention and nowhere does it state this type of retention. If you are going to have standing water, you will have to treat this area. I think what is proposed is a bad way of retaining water and I do not think it is allowable in Buffalo Grove. Mr. Seaberg said there is no intent in the Ordinance saying how this must be done. Commissioner Harris said he would hate to see all of our green areas flood everytime we have a storm, which is what we are doing. Also, we will have a health problem with mosquitoes and stagnant water. Mr . Seaberg said this is going to drain underground into catch basins where it will drain out of the property. Commissioner Yost said, but these release pipes are for a two-year storm so if we get any more than that, we are going to have wet areas for lengths of time. My interpretation of the Ordinance is that this is not allowed. Mr. Seaberg said he might not agree with it when the final plans come in and will ask to have it changed, but this cannot be determined now. Commissioner Harris said in the Annexation Agreement, Paragraph 21 , Page 8 , regarding signs, you use some very vague terms such as "conventional signs" . Mr. Gingold said there is a size limitation in our Ordinance that they want to exceed (10 x 40) . Commissioner Harris stated this comes under the Zoning Board of Appeals and you will have to go to them and ask for a variation. Mr . Gingold said why doesn't the Plan Commission stipulate "no sign over 10 x 40 "'? Chairman Genrich suggested this be left to the Village Board. Commissioner Harris said, in the "strip" Annexation Agreement, Page 5, Paragraph 8 , would they agree to add "nor expand present water facilities"? Mr. Beaubian agreed to this and said he would check with the owners. Commissioner Harris said his reasoning is that if the well dries up, they should tie in to the Village water system. He then asked why they changed their request from M-P to M-1? Mr . Beaubian said M-1 is more specific. Commissioner Harris said he only received a tax study on the School District and wanted to know if they had one for the Village. Mr. Sheridan said, because of the substantial revenue generated for the Village, they met with Dan Larson and agreed the tax revenue will surpass the requirements. They did not want to attempt to evaluate it at this time, but only tried to determine the requirements. He 3/14/73 said they cannot evaluate the commercial or industrial parcels at this point, so rather than put in an arbitrary number, we are putting in the minimum. Commissioner Mendenhall left at 10:35 P .M. He made a statement for the record that he had no major objections to the project, and as far as the reversion of the zoning, I think the Annexation \./ Agreement spells it out quite well. Chairman Genrich closed the Public Hearing at 10 :45 P.M. The members present then went into a workshop with the Hawthorn representatives until 1 :20 A.M. Respectfully submitted, Recording Secreta0 Approved: Carl Genrich, Chairman