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1983-07-06 - Plan Commission - Minutes PUBLIC HEARING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION Cedar View July 6, 1983 Commissioner Goldspiel called the Public Hearing to order at 7:44 P.M. in the Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove, Illinois Commissioners Present: Mr. Goldspiel Mr. Davis Mrs. Reid Mrs. Kaszubowski Mr. Krug Mr. Goldberg Mr. Musfeldt Commissioners Absent: Mr. Shields Mrs. Sheldon Also Present: Mr. D. Haller, Cedar View Developer Mr. J. Nelson, Cedar View Land Planner Mr. J. DiClementi, Cedar View Landscape Architect Mr. J. Koenen, Cedar View Engineer Mr. D. Laske Arlington Heights Resident Mr. and Mrs. D. Adams, Arlington Heights Residents Mr. J. Barger, Associate Superintendent District 21 Mr. W. Warnack, Village of Arlington Heights Lawyer Ms. K. Gooth, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. J. Strahammer, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. S. Cutler, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. P. Cross, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. B. Work, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. M. Sax, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. D. Spaner, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. Grattis, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. Hyman, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. R. Cohn, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. R. Skelton, Village Attorney, Buffalo Grove Mr. S. Stone, Buffalo Grove Village Trustee Mr. D. DeLance, Buffalo Grove Park Director Mr. J. Doyle, Village Buffalo Grove Assistant Village Manager Mr. R. Kuenkler, Village Engineer In the absence of a chairman or vice chairman, Commissioner Davis moved with Commissioner Reid seconding, that Commissioner Goldspiel be appointed Chairman Pro Tem. The vote was unanimously favorable. - 2 - Chairman Goldspiel read the :mtification of the Public Hearing as published in the Hearld on June 21, 1983. He informed the audience of the format the meeting would take and swore in Messrs Haller, Nelson, DeClementi and Koenen. Mr. Haller briefly reviewed his plan noting its location and density which is 9.1 units per acre. He stated the product is a multiplex unit that looks like a long single family house consisting of four and eight unit buildings. Mr. Nelson reviewed the land plan and noted the areas that surround the site. It is proposed to be annexed and zoned as R-9. They are requesting considera- tion and approval of their preliminary site plan. He also showed a rendering of the proposed product, which is a flat over flat type unit similar to many manor homes that have been built in the area. The difference is each indivi- dual unit has access from the garage as well as direct entrance from the out- side. There are no internal components in the buildings. There are four entrances in the center of the buildings and two entrances on the side. They have tried to reduce the scale of the structures. The property is 14. 5 acres. The primary access is from Dundee Road. Be explained the property is restricted by access. It is about a quarter mile in length and four hundred ninety-five feet (495) deep in a north/south direction. There are non- residential uses on the north side of the site. The east boundary abuts an R-5 Cook County single family area. The south boundary and west boundary are the village limits of Arlington Heights. The southern boundary has the Northgate Subdivision and the western boundary line is Frenchman's Cove PUD with a multi-family use. Immediately adjacent to this site on the west is a low area that is to be deeded to the Buffalo Grove Park District from Arlington Heights. Currently there is only one access from Dundee Road. There is no other permanent access to the property. They have made every effort to get Page Road opened to the development but have been unsuccessful in their negotiations with Arlington Heights. They are providing a fire lane at the southwest corner of the Kingswood United Methodist Church property and adjacent to the Arlington Heights/Buffalo Grove fire station. The plan conforms to the Buffalo Grove Comprehensive Plan and the intergovernmental agreement between Arlington Heights and Buffalo Grove. The density is below what is required. The plan has the same amenities as a townhome development. They are requesting two variances for a sidewalk on one side of the dedicated street and a reduction of the right-of-way from sixty feet to fifty-four feet. They will provide a supplementary sidewalk which is a green belt link. They have provided a sidewalk system along the extreme southwestern cul-de-sac for access to Riley school. The detention will be a proposed wet pond. The site drains from west to east and the pond will be located at the east end. It will be maintained by the condominium association. They have two green islands in the cul-de-sacs. There are one hundred thirty-two (132) units. The building cover is twenty- six percent of the land and there is a total of sixty-five percent open space. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 - 3 - Mr. DeClementi showed a landscape plan and briefly reviewed it. There will be a dense hedge separating the bank and church from the site. They requested the detention be wet because of its aesthetic appeal. The south property line will have a berm that will be five feet in some areas. They would like permission to group trees rather than plant them every fifty feet as required. The landscaping to the north for the office piece is the same as previously approved. This in addition to a tree line is sufficient landscaping for that area. The turf will be fifty percent seed and fifty percent sod. The landscaping plan is of a preliminary nature. They have a list of materials on the plan that they will choose from. Mr. Haller stated the village engineer has agreed the area is sufficient to handle the detention pond. The sanitary and water systems have been approved by staff. They are trying to bring an attractive product into the market. They feel fourty to fifty percent of the units will be occupied by families and the rest would be young professionals. They contemplate the list prices would be in the high sixties through mid eighties and average in the mid seventies. Mr. Barger stated he was concerned with access for the children of this site to Riley school and this question had been answered. The District had not requested a street, simply access so that the children could walk to school. He asked that there be some access for the first residents with children going to Riley School as the permanent sidewalk may not be in at that time. Mr. Haller felt he could do this. Mr. DeLance briefly reviewed his letter to Mr. Truesdell dated June 20, 1983. He requested that the Park District receive their cash donation at the onset of the project. Mr. Doyle referred to Mr. Truesdell's memo of July 1, 1983 to the Plan Commi- ssion titled Cedar View Manor Homes Public Hearing - Preliminary Plan Review and stated this plan conforms to the Village ordinances and the recommendations of the Plan Commission. The only unresolved question was the wet or dry detention. Mr. Kuenkler stated wet or dry the detention would work the same. He felt it was going to be a maintenance problem for the condominium association if it were wet. In response to Commissioner Goldberg, Mr. Doyle stated the density is deter- mined by the gross area before the right-of-way's have been dedicated. Under the current zoning ordinance the density for this project is 9.1. in response to Commissioner Davis, Mr. Kuenkler stated the aeration of this and all village ponds would be no later than one year after it is started. This will have a 3 to 1 slope. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 - 4 - In response to Commissioner Davis, Mr. Haller stated there would be a low fence around the pond to prevent small children from falling in. Older children who can climb fences could not be kept out. In response to Commissioner Davis, Mr. Koenen stated the pond would be eight feet deep to maintain fish. If there were to be a pond the size would be very similar to one of the ponds at Villa Verde. At a hundred year storm it will be filled to the top but not overflowing. There would be a storm level over the normal level of an additional five feet. Chairman Goldspiel questioned flooding and the site. Mr. Kuenkler stated the development of this project will not cause additional flooding in Dun Lo Highlands. It will tend to reduce the flooding. There is no village storm system in that area. There is very definite drainage coming down to Dun Lo Highlands. Nothing has ever been done along Three States Boulevard to alleviate this. The only Village storm system would be on Golfview other than Dundee Road. The natural flow patters is from west to east. Chairman Goldspiel felt if Frenchman's Cove Park was improved the residents of this site should be encouraged to use it by providing access to it. Mr. Haller felt they could incorporate that into the plan. Chairman Goldspiel stated the Village has been careful to provide for the problem of headlights shining into units by skillful use of landscaping. He would appreciate some thought be given to this. He noted the tree require- ments were not stenciled in on the Golfview right-of-way. In response to Commissioner Reid, Mr. Haller stated until the back portion of the bank property is done there would be temporary emergency access through the Kingswood United Methodist Church lot. Mr. Warnack, lawyer for Arlington Heights Village was representing the Mayor and Village Trustees. They had passed a resolution in April, 1983 stating they were opposed to this plan. They felt this plan does not conform to the intergovernmental agreement adopted in 1976. Their main objection is that the development is not townhomes. They felt this is an eight flat apartment building. Towuhomes are adjacent single family units with first and second story;: living quarters and possibly basements. Be stated that Mr Haller is aware of the agreement that has been enforce for many years. Mr.Maxnack felt to do a good quality townbome development the developer would have to put in more expensive units and use higher quality materials. Commissioner Davis stated they received minutes of a Buffalo Grove Village Board meeting of March 17, 1956 at which the boundary agreement was discussed. The trustee's concluded it was not binding. Also according to advise from Buffalo Grove's attorney, the supreme court has ruled that municipalities have no right to zone property outside of its territory. The Village felt this agreement was a statement of intent but not binding. They believe the document Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 - 5 - is not enforcable. Mr. Nelson noted they have planned for a lower density product than what appears on the agreement. What ever classification you give a product the market determines the price. The market or type of people will determine who purchases a unit. They are proposing a building type. They are trying to make it aesthetically pleasing, comply with general planning principles, and the ordinances of Buffalo Grove. He felt that if the rear views of townhome and multiplex units were put up for review very few of the audience could tell the difference. They could build a much cheeper townhome unit that is not aesthetically pleasing with a greater density on this site. The definition of townhomes has been changed for many years. He felt a definition for town- homes should have been in this intergovernmental agreement. This plan has all the amenities of a townhome development. He felt the question was one of whether the product has a negative impact on the area or not. Mr. Skelton stated that it is their opinion that the agreement is not binding on the Village. Mr. Haller stated this project provides a one story elevation for the elderly. They make up a big segment of the market. Ms. Gooth has concern about access from Page Road. Chairman Goldapiel briefly reviewed the preivcus testimony on this issue. Mr. Laske reviewed some of the background of the site. In response to one of his questions Mr. DeClementi stated the shade trees would have a 3" to 4" diameter, intermediate trees, evergreens 5' to 7' tall and the spreading evergreens would be 3' to 4' tall. The type of material to be used in specific locations will be determined at the time of planting. Mr. Nelson stated the refuse will be stored in the garage. Mr. Haller stated he plans to start building this year and complete the pro- ject in three years. Ms. Strachammer was concerned with the water problem in her area. Chairman Goidspiel briefly reviewed the previous testimony regarding that area. Be stated the water flow would be less over a longer period of time. Ms. Cutler felt the traffic would be coming into Northgate from this develop- ment and compound their problem. Chairman Goldspiel suggested that their comprehensive plan be reviewed and stated part of this problem is because access from Arlington Heights has been cut off to this project. Ms. Cross felt this product was not saleable as people were looking for single family or townhomes and suggested Arlington Heights would open up their streets if single family were built here. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 - 6 - Ms. Work was concerned about the children this project would generate. Mr. Haller stated there would be very few from his past experience with this type of product. In response to Ms. Sax, Mr. Haller stated at this point he could not deter- mine how many units would have one, two or three bedrooms. In response to Ms. Sax, Mr. Doyle stated Three States Boulevard right-of-way opening up would require the joint effort of Arlington Heights, Buffalo Grove and the county. Ms. Spanner was assured by Mr. Kuenkler that there would be no access to Dun Lo Highlands from this project as there was a permanent barrier to prevent it. In response to Mr. Grattis, Chairman Goldspiel stated the Commission does not review the financial strengths of prospective builders. Performance bonds are required to insure that the proper improvements are made. Mr. DeLance, in response to Mr. Grattis, stated the Park District requested the developer donate the cash contribution in lieu of land and Mr. Haller has agreed to do up to $12,500.00 of improvements in Frenchman's Cove Park. Mr. Wideman stated his concern that the Commission was considering this plan over a previous plan he preferred. Mr. Hyman was concerned about the flooding, the number of bedrooms per unit and would like to see a rear view of the buildings. Mr. Nelson stated the bedroom issue is one where they are given the flexibility to build what the market dictates. They have shown a drawing of the largest building type tonight and with in that they will arrange the units. They are not required, at this point, to submit floor plans. Commissioner Goldberg felt that one of the requirements for the project should be that at the Village Board meeting renderings be submitted showing the rear of the buildings. Ms. Cohn stated that in 1978 Mr. Haller showed the Northgate Civic Association a plan with single family homes buffering Northgate but this plan did not pass the Commission. Ms. Adams stated the property is lower than the adjacent single family homes. `./ The buffer of five feet will only bring the land up to the level of the single family homes and no more. Mr. DeClementi replied they would like to bring the buffer up to six feet. In response to Ms. Adams, Mr. Haller stated the landscaping would probably be Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 - 7 - between $1,000.00 and $2,000.00 per unit. He could not give a definite answer at this time. Ms. Adams, speaking as a trustee for the Northgate Civic Association, noted that at a previous meeting with the association, Mr. Haller submitted a plan and stated that if the association did not like it he would walk from the project. The plan was rejected but Mr. Haller still pursued his develop- ment. They have worked with him for the last five years to come up with a mutually agreeable project. Chairman Goldspiel stated that it is not unusual for a developer to have had several plans before they come before the Plan Comeission. He appreciated Ms. Adams input. Mr. Adams felt that Arlington Heights and Buffalo Grove were neighbors. After this plan is developed and the developer is gone they will still be neighbors. He requested the Commission not force a plan on them they did not like. Chairman Goldspiel closed the public hearing at 9:56 P.M. Respectfullysubmitted, --Iathleen Comer Recording Secretary APPROVED BY: Patrick Shields Chairman Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Public Hearing July 6, 1983 REGULAR MEETING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION Cedar View July 6, 1983 Commissioner Goldspiel called the Regular Meeting to order at 10:04 P.M. in the Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard, Buffalo Grove, Illinois. Commissioners Present: Mr. Goldspiel Mr. Davis Mrs. Reid Mrs. Kaszubowski Mr. Krug Mr. Goldberg Mr. Musfeldt Commissioners Absent: Mr. Shields Mrs. Sheldon Also Present: Mr. D. Haller, Cedar View Developer Mr. J. Nelson, Cedar View Land Planner Mr. J. DiClementi, Cedar View Landscape Architect Mr. J. Koenen, Cedar View Engineer Mr. D. Iaske, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. and Mrs. D. Adams, Arlington Heights Residents Mr. Jr. Barger, Associate Superintendent District 21 Mr. W. Warnack, Arlington Heights Village Attorney Ms. K. Gooth, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. S. Cutler, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. P. Cross, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. R. Work, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. N. Sax, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. D. Spaner, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. Grattis, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. Hyman, Arlington Heights Resident Ms. R. Cohn, Arlington Heights Resident Mr. R. Skelton, Village Attorney, Buffalo Grove Mr. S. Stone, Buffalo Grove Village Trustee Mr. D. Delance, Buffalo Grove Park Director Mr. J. Doyle, Assistant Village Manager Mr. B. Ketiinkler, Village Engineer In the absence of a chairman or vice chairman, Commissioner Davis moved with Commissioner Reid seconding, that Commissioner Goldspiel be appointed Chairman Pro Tem. The vote was unanimously favorable. - 2 APPROVAL OF MINUTES Moved by Commissioner Reid, seconded by Commissioner Davis to approve the June 15, 1983 Public Hearing minutes on the Buffalo Grove Commerce Center Unit 2-B Rezoning. The vote was unanimously favorable with Commissioner Goldberg abstaining. Moved by Commissioner Kaszubowski, seconded by Commissioner Reid to approve the June 15, 1983 Public Hearing minutes on the Northwood Grove Unit 2 Agreement Extension. The vote was unanimously favorable with Commissioner Goldberg abstaining. Moved by Comissioner Davis, seconded by Commissioner Kaszubowski to table the minutes of June 15, 1983 Regular Meeting until the next Plan Commission meeting. The vote was unanimously favorable with Commissioner Goldberg abstaining. COMMITTEE AND LIAISON REPORTS Commissioner Reid attended the June 27, 1983 Village Board meeting at which the Northwood Grove Unit 2 Agreement extension was approved and extended for another two years. It was not vacated. Chairman Goldspiel reported on the joint meeting between representatives of the Transportation Commission and the Plan Commission. They are looking for a way of developing a corridor plan for Dundee Road and the Soo Line Railroad. Staff is reviewing master plans from surrounding adjacent communities and will submit their input for review by the joint committee. CEDAR VIEW MANOR HOMES Commissioner Goldberg felt the real key to the wet cr dry detention was the input of the village engineer. He felt if the flooding of this sites neigh- bors could be helped it should be done. Mr. Kuenkler stated wet or dry would have the same effect for the residents to the east. The volume would be the same. It would not be better or worse. He thought that the residents of Plaza Verde were spending a great deal on upkeep of their pond. Commissioner Goldberg noted it is very costly to keep up the pond at Cambridge- on-the-Lake. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting July 6, 1983 - 3 - Mr. Haller stated everyone he talked to felt wet detention would be aestheti- cally pleasing and that was why he was considering it. In response to Commissioner Kaszubowski, Mr. Kuenkler replied Chatham Manor: has one wet and one dry detention area. Chairman Goldspiel's questions was answered by Mr. Haller who replied that they have not compared the detention requirements of the site between the landscape planner and the village engineer as yet. In response to Chairman Goldspiel, Mr. Koenen stated that during a one hundred year storm the water would be twenty-five feet from the buildings. The Commissioner agreed they had no objection to the wet detention provided that the village engineer approved it. Mr. Haller felt it might not be acceptable to the engineer. They are re- questing this subject to engineering and prefer it wet. Mr. Krug objected to the pond because it is a nuisance to children, a garbage collector and a breeding ground for mosquitoes. Chairman Goldspiel agreed with Mr. Krug. Mr. Doyle stated that Mr. Truesdell's memo to the Plan Commission of July 1st, titled Cedar View Manor Hanes Public Hearing - Preliminary Plan Review there have been no changes since that submittal to the Commission. The Village of Arlington Heights has not deeded over the Frenchman's Cove Park land as of this date. In response to Chairman Goldspiel, Commissioner Reid stated that Mr. Schwartz's letter to Mr. Haller dated June 21, 1983 stated the temporary access will be granted. Mr. Doyle felt that by the wording of this letter they are giving an open end agreement. This could be addressed through the language of the annexation agreement under special provisions. In response to Commissioner Goldberg, the Commission concurred the question of snow removal was settled when staff previously stated they did not want anyone taking care of that but the Village. Moved by Commissioner Reid, seconded by Commissioner Krug that the Plan Commission recommend to the Village Board approval of Mr. Hailer's plan for annexation and R-9 zoning with special use of the PUD development, Preliminary Plan dated June 14, 1983 subject to: Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting July 6, 1983 - 4 - 1 - Temporary access for fire and emergency vehicles through Kingswood United Methodist Church parking lot. 2 - Sidewalk access to Frenchman's Cove Park. 3 - Massing of foliage where lights from the street might shine into units. 4 - Resolution of wet or dry issue on detention. 5 - All proper exhibits including complete rear and side elevations be available at the Village Board meeting. Discussion: Commissioner Davis did not like the cul-de-sacs. He has reviewed the boundary agreement since the start of the meeting as he had not previously had a copy, and feels it is binding and cannot vote for this plan. He felt the Commission should take that into consideration. Commissioner Krug stated the only key word that binds the Village is "townhome". He felt is has many names and now they are shaped differently. It is not defined in the intergovernmental agreement. He felt this is still a single family attached dwelling and a townhouse. Commissioner Goldberg felt the purpose of the Commission is to concern itself with the planning and annexation. The attorney is paid for his opinion and he states it is satisfactory to continue with this project. He is not concer- ned with the boundary agreement. From a legal point of view he is not concerned about acting on this. Commissioner Kaszubowski is not concerned with the boundary agreement. She felt this is a question for the Village Board to decide. She voted against the plan that contained the single family homes because it was a bad plan. She was not particularly happy with this plan. She was not sure she was ready to vote on this plan after hearing all the testimony and would prefer time to review the material before making her decision. Chairman Goldspiel stated the Commission was not required to vote on this plan tonight. Commissioner Reid noted access was one of her main concerns. She reviewed the testimony regarding opening up Three States Boulevard. She does not �./ know what more can be done to this plan to make it workable. Commissioner Goldberg stated regarding the drop off, according to the topography, there is only a two foot drop between the corner of Mr. Laske'a property and this site. What happened when his home was built could be another matter. Everything on this site drains to the east. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting duly 6, 1983 - 5 - In response to Commissioner Musfeldt, Mr. DeClementi stated the berm will make the land level with the single family homes. The intent is to screen. If they cannot get up that high, they will try to achieve it with natural material. They will get more than a satisfactory screen. They are working within a three to one slope. In response to Commissioner Goldberg, Mr. Kuenkler stated all of the Village berms are three to one and are still movable. The Commission was polled whether to table the vote on Cedar View or vote at this meeting. No indicating tabling the plan. Yes indicating to proceed with the vote. AYES: Commissioners Davis, Reid, Goldberg, Musfeldt NAYES: Commissioners Kaszubowski, Krug The poll was favorable 4 - 2. Commissioner Goldberg stated in deference to Commissioner Kaszubowski he would be happy to table the vote to another evening and asked why she wanted to delay. He felt this project has been before the Commission for some time. Commissioner Kaszubowski restated her view that she could not vote for personal reasons. The material was sufficient. Commissioner Goldberg amended Point 4 of the motion to read "The wet de- tention meets the engineering requirements and Village codes. " Chairman Goldspiel noted that the certified mail receipts for notification of the residents living within 250 feet of the site had been received by the Village. AYES: Commissioners Reid, Goldberg, Goldspiel NAYES: Commissioner Davis - because of the boundary agreement Commissioner Krug - because of the exceptions for the right-of-way, sidewalks and the long cul-de-sacs. ABSTAIN: Commissioners Kaszubowski, Musfeldt ABSENT: Commissioners Shields, Sheldon The vote was favorable 3-2-2 and the motion passed. ADJOURNMENT Moved by Commissioner Davis, seconded by Commissioner Goldberg to adjourn the meeting. The vote was unanimously favorable and Chairman Goldspiel adjourned the meeting at 11:00 P.M. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting July 6, 1983 - 6 - Respectfully submitted, Ka hleen Comer Recording Secretary APPROVED BY: fAe6760„, 67a,beof‘") Patrick Shields Chairman 1 `.i Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting July 6, 1983