Loading...
1979-11-07 - Plan Commission - Minutes REGULAR MEETING BUFFALO GROVE PLAN COMMISSION Dundee Road Traffic Presentation Happ Farm Comprehensive Plan - Land Use NOVEMBER 7, 1979 Chairman Shields called the meeting to order at 7:45 P.M. in the Municipal Building, 50 Raupp Boulevard. Commissioners Present: Chairman Shields Mr. Goldspiel Mr. Button Mr. Davis Mrs. Reid Mr. Shifrin Mr. Glover Commissioners Absent: Mrs. Sheldon Also Present: Mr. James Mastandrea, Happ Farm Mr. James Mikes, Attorney, Happ Farm Mr. Rick Burton, Land Planner, Happ Farm Mr. Marco Franco, Engineer, Happ Farm Mr. Joe McBride, Engineer, Happ Farm Mr. Bill Kiddie, Buffalo Grove Park District Mr. Bill O'Reilly, Buffalo Grove Park District Sgt. John Crimmins, Buffalo Grove Police Department Mr. John Mafienthal, Village Trustee Mrs. Bobbie O'Reilly, Village Trustee Mr. Bill Sommers, Assistant Village Manager Mr. Jim Truesdell, Staff Planner APPROVAL OF MINUTES Commissioner Button moved to approve the minutes of October 31, 1979, with th e following correction: Page 5, paragraph 2, sentence 2: Should read, "The State Police. . ." . Commissioner Reid seconded the motion, which passed unanimously. Commissioner Button and Goldspiel abstained. BDDC Chairman Shields stated there will be no meeting of the BDDC in November. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 -2- TRANSPORTATION COMMISSION Commissioner Goldspiel stated that the transportation survey of the Village has been drafted and will be reviewed on November 19, and if approved, will be used as a basis for future transportation planning. l TRAFFIC PRESENTATION - DUNDEE ROAD . Sgt. John Crimmins of the Buffalo Grove Police Department displayed a map showing the accidents in Buffalo Grove since the first of the year. He explained that the yellow pins were property damage accidents, the red pins represent personal injury accidents, and the flags represent 10 accidents. He stated there is a heavy concentration in our Dundee Road area, mostly at Arlington Heights Rd. and Buffalo Grove Rd. Sgt. Crimmins stated that at the end of October, there had been 636 accidents in the Village and approximately 375 of those were on Dundee Road. There have been two fatalities, one at Buffalo National Bank on Dundee Road and one at Buffalo Grove Rd. and Route 83. Commissioner Button asked if Sgt. Crimmins thought the volume of accidents on Dundee Rd. was due to the volume of traffic or to the design of the road. He stated that the accidents were due to driver error. Sgt. Crimmins thinks that Dundee Rd. is a basically well designed road. Some of the problems ate - the exit from Golfview Terrace where there is no light. There is also a good con- centration of accidents in the Ellen and Bette Drive area. He stated that the area of the Happ Farm does not have a lot of accidents at this time. It was established that this was because there are not many curb cuts in that area. Sgt. Crimmins stated that the spped limit increases in the area from Lieberman Plaza to the High School. If there was a stop light at Golfview Terrace, it would meet the criteria to drop the speed limit. We cannot do that yet because they say there is not enought ingress and egress there. Sgt. Crimmins stated that there is such a concentration of traffic on Dundee Rd. that speed enforcement is difficult. He said if they see a violation going in the opposite direction, it is impossible to stop them. Sgt. Cummins stated that a main factor is having the people know they can be there when needed. Sgt. Crimmins stated thetehhas been a /0% reduction in accidents since the in- ception of the traffic unit, and the Volume of traffic has probably increased 20% since that time. Commissioner Shifrin asked Sgt. Crimmins what the ro osed p p project would do to traffic on Dundee Rd. Sgt. Crimmins stated it would be hard to say, but possi- bly bringing some of the traffic out on White Pine might lessen accidents at Arlington Heights Rd. and Buffalo Grove Rd. If we were to get a stop light, I�I Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 -3- we could possibly reduce our speed limit in that area, which would be a plus. Just the fact that the stop light is there, would slow down the traffic. In response to a question from Commissioner Goldspiel, Sgt. Crimmins stated that specifically on Dundee Rd. , probably the largest accident-causing viola- tion is going too fast for conditions, turn violations and failure to yield when coming out of gas stations, etc. L/ Commissioner Davis stated that at the two major intersections, we have gas stations with two entrances, one at the corner and one further back from the corner. Would it be advisable to close the one closest to the traffic signal. Sgt. Crimmins said he could see advantages to that. Commissioner Button asked what the speed limit is noxtoto the project. Sgt. Crimmins said it is 50 mph. Sgt. Crimmins stated that the intersection of Route 83 and Checker Rd. is a disaster. Commissioner Davis asked if he saw a need for a pedestrian overpass for children going to school. Sgt. Crimmins said not at this time. HAPP FARM Chairman Shields stated the purpose of this meeting is to discuss the prelim- inary plan and set a date for the Public Hearing. Mr. Burton stated they had made suggested changes in the plan. They have in- corporated a radius of 450 ft. . They rerouted White Pine Rd. so it does not intersect Weidner. They made a loop street instead of cul-de-sacs. Regarding the garages which should be set back 25 ft., there is no problem with that. He said the first 4-unit building shows a setback from the High School property of 30 ft. There is a disagreement in the interpretation of the Ordinance, and they will look at it again. Mr. Burton stated the number of units remains the same. There will be 204 manor homes and 270 multi-family. They have reduced the square footage of the office park from 250,000 sq. ft. to 240,000 sq. ft. He said they can live with the B-3 zoning. With these changes, they ended up with an increase in the percentage of open area. Mr. Burton stated the garages would be built into the slope. They will not only screen the garages, but also the parking area and some of the buildings. Mr. Mastandrea stated they changed the garage line so it is not a straight line. Mr. Burton said the handicapped parking is shown by the X 's. These parking spaces will be 12 ft. wide instead of 9 ft. The parking ratio and density is essentially the same. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 -4- Mr. Marienthal asked what the garages would be like in the rest of the devel- opment. Mr. Burton said it woulddepend on the final Engineering, but they will beivi up to them as much as they can. Commissioner Davis stated that this is the most unimaginative plan he has ever seen. Commissioner Shifrin agreed. Commissioner Davis stated there is a lot of green area, but no play area, and feels a lot can be done by clustering and using some imagination. He also feels the parking for the office center `./ should be depressed. Mr. Burton stated the Park District has chosen to take money instead of the land. Mr. Truesdell stated that to cluster this plan more would mean building high- er,buildings. They also plan a heavy concentration of landscaping. Commission- er Davis stated it would not bother him to go higher. Mr. Truesdell stated that most of the staff commentb have been resolved. The street width in the cul-de-sacs where pavement is reduced to 24 ft., under the PUD, the 27 ft. requirement has been waived. Also, the driveways are approx- imately 40 ft. in width because they are serving 4 garages. Overall you are seeing a lesser amount of cohcEete than if they were all separate. Commissioner Goldspiel stated he agrees with a lot of what Commissioner Davis said. He feels it would be preferable on this property, to go higher. That would be more suitable to a busy area like Dundee Rd. He said he now likes the garages and feels they make a good buffer. Commissioner Goldspiel stated that, aside from the Ordinance, he is not sure there is enough parking. He said he is concerned about the absence of useable open space. In this type if development, you need a park and am not happy the park land shrunk. It appears that all that is left is detention. Commissioner Goldspiel stated he is disappointed that the decision was made to give cash in lieu of land to the High School. The High School is very, very cramped for land compared to other high schools in this area. He stated he wants to be sure the path at the north end is high and dry enough to be useable even when the ( detention basin is full. Mr. Mastandrea stated that he chose to go with garages instead of open parking because of the market, and the bedroom count should not attract more than two drivers per family. Commissioner Goldspiel stated that the rear yards of the units next to the park look awfully small. Mr. Mastandrea said he would like to hire a professional to design a park in Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 -5- the park detention area because he feels something could be done. Mr. Marco stated that the detention during a 10 year storm would be approxi- mately 2 hours and about 6 inches deep. The 100 year storm would be 6 hours and about 3 - 32 feet. He said that anything over a 3 year storm would have water for 1 or 2 hours. The lowest point would have a maximum depth of 7 feet at the north end. Mr. Mastandrea stated that he is confident they can engineer this properly to drain and be useable as a park. He suggested we consider taking it as a park and he would be willing to put up a Letter of Credit. We could then try it j for a year and if we did not like it, we could cash in the Letter of Credit. f Mr. Kiddie a section of the Ordinance setting the criteria for acceptable park land. He stated that, as presented, they were shown a plan of a basin which would have a good deal of water btanding in it. This is not under the criteria and is not acceptable at this time. At this time, they do not have a park and so the Park District prefers to collect the money. He said that if Mr. Mastandrea is willing to put in a park with all of the facilities and landscaping then they would talk about it. Mr. Mastandrea stated he is asking them to see if it drains, then they will take the money set aside and use it to put in recreational equipment. Mr. O'Reilly stated that the presentation made to the Park District was very preliminary and lasted about 15 minutes. At that time, they saw a Mill Creek type of park here. The Park District needs useable land right now. One nega- tive aspect of the site is its proximity to the homes. One improvement is the accessibility to the site, but am concerned about the width. He stated that the grade came to 4% and 1% is more acceptable as useable area. If this can be turned into a Bicentennial Park, he would not hesitate to accept it. Mr. McBride stated that Mr. O'Reilly is correct about the grade and with the underdrain system, they can bring the grade down. Commissioner Davis stated that they are talking about bringing in 84 pre-school children and 27 elementary aged children. They have a lot of green space but no play areas. There might be an advantage to going to a fourth floor and opening up space for useable tot areas. If you are going to bring in 113'_ `: children under the age of 10 years old, you should have a place for them to play. Commissioner Glover said he wouldllike to see some exploration done on under- ground drains. Perhaps it would be possible to make a natural pond at the north end which would be esthetic and would make the rest of the area more useable. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 -6- Mr. Franco stated that they have the problem of water backing up from the ditch. Mr. McBride said this is a point they H111710 1 into:c Commissioner Glover asked them what they are going to do with the existing marshy area. He stated that it appeared they were building on some of it and what were they going to do with the rest to the north. Mr. Burtonstated that they had soil borings done and the soil has a good bearing capacity, but is slightly wet because it is so flat. He said the drainage will be improved. Commissioner Glover stated that he was glad to see they had broken up the line of the garages, but that when they go to a 25 ft. setback on the east, that will put them more in line again for175 ft. of continuous garages. He said he did not see how they were going to be able to berm them on the east side. Mr. McBride stated they will be depressing the garages and they will start out about 2 feet down. It has not been fully studied as to what the final grade in that area will be. The landscaping will magnify the berming they will be able to get. Commissioner Glover stated that he would like to see them loosen up the den- sity , which would certainly make it more appealing. Commissioner Button stated he has concerns about the traffic generated by the project and he would also much rather see greater height. Mr. Mastandrea stated that once you go over 3 stories, you get into elevators, which is a whole different cost, etc. Commissioner Shifrin stated that, with respect to traffic, we had a traffic study by these people that indicated the opening up of Lake-Cook Rd. west of Arlington Heights Rd. would relieve traffic on Dundee Rd. ; and when I see traf- fic backed up from Rand Rd. to Wheeling Rd., I tend to be skeptical about that study. Commissioner Goldspiel stated he would like the staff to pay particular atten- tion to changing the profile of the detention area on the north; what affect if any it would have on the lots that back up to it, because the:;people who live there are concerned with drainage and would like a staff investigation for the Public Hearing. Mr. James Kowieski, 2 Beech oodhGourtCEazt, asked why they couldn't run the drainage from the High School under ground so the children would have a dry place to walk, and perhaps have a bike path. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 ..i �.i - --------- --- -7- Mr. Mastandrea stated that once you restrict the ditch, you restrict its capa- city. Mr. Kowieski stated that they originally proposed to have that covered and have a bike path there. There are several neighbors who are very concerned about having a swail behind them. If there is a way to have a dry park, there must be a way to do this so the children would not have to cross a creek. If you can pipe it from the south, you can pipe it from the west. Mr. Mastandrea stated that the bike path was removed because it was part of the contribution to the Park District. Mr. Kowieski stated that it would have been a bike path at the bottom of a potentially wet swail. Commissioner Goldspiel stated that he had not been aware that the bike path had disappeared. It is an absolute essential feature because you have high school children (and there will be more and more as the area grows) and I cannot imagine that piece without the bike path there. 1 Commissioner Davis stated that a bike path is not a park donation. Mr. O 'Reilly stated that when the plan was shown to them, the bike path was below water level. It also connected to the high school, but it did not connect to anything at the east end, and access to the bike path was through back yards. We are looking for a connection to the White Pine area. Commissioner Goldspiel stated that he assumed it would hook up with White Pine Road. Mr. Kiddie stated that they would be glad to hold a Special Meeting on Novem- ber 29 with the developer. He said they are open to further discussion on this matter. Mr. Mastandrea stated that they will be notifying people within 400 ft. of the subject property because of the width of Dundee Rd. Trustee Marienthal stated that the drainage along the north property line was to be enclosed. Mr. Mastandrea said the recommendation of the Village Engineer and their engineer was to keep it open. Trustee Marienthal stated that it was the feeling of the majority of the Village Board members that it should be enclosed pipe. Chairman Shields called a recess at 9:37. The meeting reconvened at 9:50. Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 i �/ i I -- -- __ - ---- ------------- - -8- COMPREHENSIVE PLAN - LAND USE ANALYSIS Mr. Truesdell stated that the first section is Environmental Analysis and is the same thing that is in the current plan. He said he added a minor paragraph which reflected some work that has been done recently by the Lake County Plan- ning Department. They have their open space and natural resources planned. That is something the Village may want to look into in terms-,of determining which areas to be more careful in developing and to set some guidelines. The second section is Community Development Analysis. The first section re- lates to population. The main source was the 1978 census of Buffalo Grove. There was a population of 20,609. There has been a slight increase in the non-white population. In 1970, school age people represented 33% of the total population and in 1978, it had dropped to 28%. There was no increase of pre- school aged children from 1970 to 1978. Mr. Truesdell stated that we have to be aware of the sharp decline in school aged children and an increase in older people and we may have to gear our activities to this section of the population. Commissioner Batton stated that because of the economic situation, you find that the younger single or multiple person households are not staying in the suburbs. They are staying closer to the metro area and marriages are being delayed. The average person is being married at 22-25 and are not planning on having children for 8-10 years. Mr. Sommer added that they also are not planning to have as many children. Mr. Truesdell stated that the Table No. 4 on page 16 shows Buffalo Grove com- pared to the satellite cities. The residential area is higher than the aver- age. Commissioner Glover stated that he feels the section on Industrial Uses on page 17 should be reworded to a more positive stand. Commissioner Button suggested it say - - "although Buffalo Grove suffered in the past from poor accessibility, that situation is being remedied." Mr. Truesdell agreed it should be written more positively. Mr. Truesdell stated that we are the opposite of the national average in the areas of Public Buildings and Parks and Recreation. He feels the reason we are low on public buildings is because we do not have a Post Office or a Library. The reason we are above average in the area of parks is because of the Golf Course. Commissioner Reid also brought up the fact that the school playgrounds are considered parks here, but most municipalities do not look at them in that way. Mr. Truesdell stated that in the Housing Section, we have been seeing an increase in the number of multi-family units and we should be aware of the growing need Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November 7, 1979 i �� -9- for some low-cost housing. He said that a family of 4, making $17,300 is con- sidered eligible for subsidized housing. You will find a lot of younger people in this category and it might be a good idea to consider housing of this nature, possibly for the children of families living in Buffalo Grove. Commissioner Goldspiel disagreed on the basis that the people in subsidized hous- ing are not the children of the people in the area. As was stated earlier, the younger people are going into the city and I don't think they want what we have to offer. Commissioner Glover stated he feels the multi-family homes are low-cost housing. Mr. Truesdell stated he would ltkk into the northwest area and see just how much subsidized housing there is. Regarding the Transportation Section, Mr. Truesdell stated he had prepared a map showing the major routes in the area which can receive Federal funding for improve- ments. He stated there was a large increase of traffic on Dundee Road during the 3-year period between 1972 and 1975. Commissioner Goldspiel said this was not a useful statistic because in 1972, Dundee Rd. and Arlington Heights Rd. were two-lane roads. He said you are comparing a 2-lane road with a 4-lane road and he would like to see the growth since Dundee Rd. and Arlington Heights Rd. have become 4 lanes. Commissioner Glover also pointed out that Dundee Rd. was under construction at various points a lot of this time. Mr. Truesdell stated that in the Public Transportation Section, he did not do much because it is difficult to determine where the routes will be in 5 years. He said he just wants to say that there is on-going planning. Commissioner Goldspiel stated he would like it to say that there are a number of Buffalo Grove residents commuting on the Milwaukee and Northwestern Railroads. Mr. Truesdell stated he hopes to come back with more sections in December. Commissioner Goldspiel stated the Transporation Commission would like to see a bus service to Hawthorn and the reason RTA did not want to do it at this time was because there is not enough development between here and Hawthorn. He- said he feels that if Fiore develops in a residential configuration similar to the rest of the Village, we might have the possibility of extending the route up there. Commissioner Glover stated he attended a meeting in which Long Grove discussed a Conservation Commission. Where there is non-buildable land in private ownership, they would be required to let it go natural. He said he feels that is something we might consider with the Fiore property. Chairman Shields stated there is a workshop on December 8 sponsored by the American Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeii ng, November 7, 1979 �� 'I I I 1 i j _ - - -10- Planning Association. There are a number of parts of the program that would be interesting regarding zoning and subdivision planning. It is at Elgin Community College. Commissioner Davis made the resolution to recommend to the Village Board that the Police Department increase the traffic unit by one additional car:-and an additional officer, because the present traffic unit has reduced traffic acci- dents by 10%. Commissioner Shifrin seconded the motion. Commissioner Goldspiel stated it is not in our jurisdiction to say how other de- partments should be manned. Commissioner Button stated he would recommend we suggest that they look into the problem of the number of traffic accidents, if it possible to reduce the speed limit, the addition of a traffic light if the Happ Farm is developed, and addi- tional coverage with existing traffic units during peak hours. Commissioner Davis stated he accepted Commissioner Button's wording of the motion. Upon a roll call vote, the motion was defeated 4-2 with the Commissioners voting as follows: AYE: Commissioners Davis and Shifrin NAY: Commissioners Goldspiel, Button, Reid, Glover ABSENT: Commissioner Sheldon ABSTAIN: None Commissioner Goldspiel made the motion the meeting be adjourned. Commissioner Glover seconded the motion, which carried unanimously. The meeting was adjourned at 11:00. Respectfully submitted, Astrid L. Hasley Recording Secretary Secreta y APPROVED BY: Patrick Shields, Chairman Buffalo Grove Plan Commission Regular Meeting November m er 7, 1979 y.. -----